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08-16-2012   #1 (permalink)
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Default Scientist & Guardian (SB or not?)

So I'm currently leveling a Scientist (and loving it) and I'm really looking into investing into my first guardian. I've done a bit of research and read Almora's very helpful General Guardian FAQ, however I'm still a bit on the edge when it comes to the build (and yes, I've taken the recommendation into heavy consideration).


For sure, I want a regular Sephirens. I'm willing to deal with the slightly weaker guardian in exchange for (you guessed it) better matching colors, since I don't really like how the other guardians' colors look.

So my real question is this: for a Scientist that will be (probably) focused on bossing, including Chaos Tower, with mastered Shield Breaker, is a Cochma's Rune (which would require me to recharge more MS) and a 4 in Sense really worthwhile?

I find my Shield Breaker missing about a third of the time so a guaranteed one does seem nice. For instance, if I miss my first Shield Breaker and Sephirens lands hers on the boss, I could fire away until my SB is off CD and attempt to land a better one. My question is this: would Sephirens be "smart" enough to recast her SB in case I miss my next one (or if there's a way to manually do so)?

If a guardian's SB isn't too crucial for a Scientist (and maybe counter-productive? if the weaker guardian SB replaces mine?), where should the other 6 points - taking into account the obligatory 6 in power - go towards? Cure and Rust sounds nice, and I will definitely be getting Skunk Pouch, although I haven't looked much into other debuffs/attacks since those were the ones I've found to be more prominent.

If anyone has a specific build suggestion (perhaps some past experiences?) I'd really appreciate it C:

Sorry for all the questions and wall of text, I just want to get as much of my doubts answered right off the bat. Thanks in advance!
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08-16-2012   #2 (permalink)
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If you don't mind casting SB if you miss, I wouldn't go for Shield Breaker on a Guardian. Yes, it's handy to have that 100% accuracy, yet slightly weaker Shield Breaker, but if you're fine with trying to cast it a couple times, then why waste money on it?

You can set your Guardian to preform a specific chain of skills.

The skills in the red box are skills that your Guardian will only cast once per engagement. The skills in the orange box are skills that your Guardian will use repeatedly. Since I only need Skunk Pouch and don't want to bog her queue down with skills I don't need, she only uses Skunk Pouch.
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08-16-2012   #3 (permalink)
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Ahh. That makes sense, thanks.

And thank you very much for the speedy response, Jare.

Yeah I was leaning towards opting out SB especially since the CD isn't really all that long and I don't mind recasting.

In that case, what other skills/debuffs would be recommended for Sephirens? Are guardians somewhat helpful for aoe (such as getting rid of chaos boss summons clogging the screen) or should I focus mainly on debuffs?
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08-16-2012   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SheepyTiffy
So I'm currently leveling a Scientist (and loving it) and I'm really looking into investing into my first guardian. I've done a bit of research and read Almora's very helpful General Guardian FAQ, however I'm still a bit on the edge when it comes to the build (and yes, I've taken the recommendation into heavy consideration).


For sure, I want a regular Sephirens. I'm willing to deal with the slightly weaker guardian in exchange for (you guessed it) better matching colors, since I don't really like how the other guardians' colors look.

So my real question is this: for a Scientist that will be (probably) focused on bossing, including Chaos Tower, with mastered Shield Breaker, is a Cochma's Rune (which would require me to recharge more MS) and a 4 in Sense really worthwhile?

I find my Shield Breaker missing about a third of the time so a guaranteed one does seem nice. For instance, if I miss my first Shield Breaker and Sephirens lands hers on the boss, I could fire away until my SB is off CD and attempt to land a better one. My question is this: would Sephirens be "smart" enough to recast her SB in case I miss my next one (or if there's a way to manually do so)?

If a guardian's SB isn't too crucial for a Scientist (and maybe counter-productive? if the weaker guardian SB replaces mine?), where should the other 6 points - taking into account the obligatory 6 in power - go towards? Cure and Rust sounds nice, and I will definitely be getting Skunk Pouch, although I haven't looked much into other debuffs/attacks since those were the ones I've found to be more prominent.

If anyone has a specific build suggestion (perhaps some past experiences?) I'd really appreciate it C:

Sorry for all the questions and wall of text, I just want to get as much of my doubts answered right off the bat. Thanks in advance!
It's preference really.

-If you don't mind giving up a stronger SB for a permanent weaker one, then slot it.
-If you don't like the idea of giving up your own SB and don't mind the consecutive fails on some bad days x.x, then don't slot it.

---

Yes, she'd be smart enough, as long as the CD permits it as well as not having cure in the repeatable slots. Having cure in the repeat slots just bugs/messes with skill recasts on normal guardians compared to spinel. Just know that if yours is already casted on the target and hasn't run out yet, Sephiren's cast will override your mastered SB with her lvl 10 one.

---
Quote:
Originally Posted by SheepyTiffy
In that case, what other skills/debuffs would be recommended for Sephirens? Are guardians somewhat helpful for aoe (such as getting rid of chaos boss summons clogging the screen) or should I focus mainly on debuffs?
Really all you need is a 2351 egg.

Power: Shockvibe, Luck Breaker
Magic: Cure, Rust, Mana Web
Sense: Stone Strike, Lucky 7, Luckyfist, SB, Armor Breaker
Charm: Skunk

---

Somewhat, only if they're fighting against level appropriate monsters. You'll always mostly be seeing 0's on the screen if you use your guardian to fight mobs twice their max level. And if they do damage, it's too little to be effective in most cases, with some exceptions. That's why they are mostly used for debuffing.
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08-16-2012   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Almora
It's preference really.

-If you don't mind giving up a stronger SB for a permanent weaker one, then slot it.
-If you don't like the idea of giving up your own SB and don't mind the consecutive fails on some bad days x.x, then don't slot it.

---

Yes, she'd be smart enough, as long as the CD permits it as well as not having cure in the repeatable slots. Having cure in the repeat slots just bugs/messes with skill recasts on normal guardians compared to spinel. Just know that if yours is already casted on the target and hasn't run out yet, Sephiren's cast will override your mastered SB with her lvl 10 one.
I suppose it is. I'm just not really sure if it's worth the 4.2k, there's definitely pros and cons x.x

I guess it might be worth the investment for fights that I don't want to bother spamming Shield Breaker on to just make it even (lower level CT bosses) and I can always just take SB out of the rotation if I prefer my own...

And I didn't know that about Cure, that's definitely something I'll take note of for later. Unfortunately I won't be investing into a Spinel, so a regular guardian will have to do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Almora
Really all you need is a 2351 egg.

Power: Shockvibe, Luck Breaker
Magic: Cure, Rust, Mana Web
Sense: Stone Strike, Lucky 7, Luckyfist, SB, Armor Breaker
Charm: Skunk
Wouldn't that result in an Ifron though?
I guess a normal non-Mighty Sephirens build may be somewhere along the lines of 5151 (with more exp in power)?

Sorry I'm so picky x3

Quote:
Originally Posted by Almora
Somewhat, only if they're fighting against level appropriate monsters. You'll always mostly be seeing 0's on the screen if you use your guardian to fight mobs twice their max level. And if they do damage, it's too little to be effective in most cases, with some exceptions. That's why they are mostly used for debuffing.
Ahh alright, that's good information to know. I was just curious since I can then maybe invest a little in magic for some AoE instead of SB, but if it's not significant I won't really bother.
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08-16-2012   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SheepyTiffy
Wouldn't that result in an Ifron though?
I guess a normal non-Mighty Sephirens build may be somewhere along the lines of 5151 (with more exp in power)?

Sorry I'm so picky x3

Ahh alright, that's good information to know. I was just curious since I can then maybe invest a little in magic for some AoE instead of SB, but if it's not significant I won't really bother.
Sorry that was just a rough skeletal build and I totally forgot that you wanted a Sephirens when I wrote that. What is up with me x.x

But yes, a 5151 will do just fine. Just make sure to get the most experience in power before you hatch. Since you are using this egg on a gunner, a 5151 is very do-able. The first thing you should start off with immediately is kill mobs =/+ 20 levels of your scientist until power is 4 with gun skills. If you can manage to get it to 5 with gun skilling, then it's good. Not sure about regular shooting.

I say 4 because that's the farthest I've ever tested with gun attacks for guardian empathy. You can leave off from whatever magic & sense you get after finishing up power stat. Make sure you use the highest MP pot! If you get a 1 in magic before sense is 4, then you'll need to spam HP pots for the 2:1 charm growth.
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08-17-2012   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Almora
But yes, a 5151 will do just fine. Just make sure to get the most experience in power before you hatch. Since you are using this egg on a gunner, a 5151 is very do-able. The first thing you should start off with immediately is kill mobs =/+ 20 levels of your scientist until power is 4 with gun skills. If you can manage to get it to 5 with gun skilling, then it's good. Not sure about regular shooting.

I say 4 because that's the farthest I've ever tested with gun attacks for guardian empathy. You can leave off from whatever magic & sense you get after finishing up power stat. Make sure you use the highest MP pot! If you get a 1 in magic before sense is 4, then you'll need to spam HP pots for the 2:1 charm growth.
Alright, I suppose it's settled for a 5151 C:
Although I'm not extremely familiar with guardian points (I've only raised an egg once and that was more on a whim/whatever is fine kind of basis) I just want to be extra careful and be sure I end up with the right build, so I suppose it's just gunning (shooting spree) til 4, MP pot til magic hits 1, then drill/compound the rest of sense (to 5) and HP pot the rest of power?

What is the difference between using a higher MP pot and a lower MP one? Does sense increase faster than magic that way?

Sorry if this isn't the right place anymore to discuss this, I'll be more than happy to move it to the 'Guardians' discussion thread on General Chat if this is better suited for there ^^; I just want to make sure I have the right idea

Thank you so much for your help Almora C:
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08-17-2012   #8 (permalink)
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I don't know exactly what the difference is, but I'd imagine it's so you're not spamming so much that you miss it. As far as I know, all MP potions give the same growth rate for Magic and Sense.
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08-17-2012   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SheepyTiffy
Alright, I suppose it's settled for a 5151 C:
Although I'm not extremely familiar with guardian points (I've only raised an egg once and that was more on a whim/whatever is fine kind of basis) I just want to be extra careful and be sure I end up with the right build, so I suppose it's just gunning (shooting spree) til 4, MP pot til magic hits 1, then drill/compound the rest of sense (to 5) and HP pot the rest of power?
Spoiler!

What is the difference between using a higher MP pot and a lower MP one? Does sense increase faster than magic that way?
Spoiler!

Sorry if this isn't the right place anymore to discuss this, I'll be more than happy to move it to the 'Guardians' discussion thread on General Chat if this is better suited for there ^^; I just want to make sure I have the right idea

Thank you so much for your help Almora C:
Answers in quote.
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08-17-2012   #10 (permalink)
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Ahhhh okay, that makes plenty of sense. I thought you meant use larger MP pots for (solely) MP pot training, but good point, I'll definitely take that into account.

Thank you SO much for the huge help, Jare and Almora! +repped you both ^^

Close thread please~ Thank you again!
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