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09-18-2008   #1 (permalink)
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Default Making a PvP Character? A Lion? Good luck.

This is not a guide or even a rant thread. Some tips are mentioned below but I really just want to discuss the much longer list of cons of choosing a lion as main character for PvP as compared to the cons of having a Lion before Revo and the things I'm going to talk about below.

Every Lion I've talked to thinks that their character sucks now in PvP (I don't know for how long it has been that way since I only came back last August) because of some few things:

1. addition of Guard skill
2. Shield of Heaven skill
3. HV Nerf

Let's talk about the Guard skill of Bunnies and Hybrid Buffalos first. We all know that Lions can attack fast because of the Double Shot + Shooting Spree combo. You can even add Landmine before casting the DS + SS (if you're a hybrid). But this quickness isn't enough because that will only be a two or three ticks off the Guard skill and it will only take one skill (or two if you have the HP) for Bunnies/Hybrid Buffalos to take you out. And as much as I did not want to say it, but some Bunnies/Hybrid Buffalos became Guard abusers. Just because they know that you won't kill them easily, they end up abusing the Guard skill and spams Uppercuts and Tetras all over PvP room.

Second, the Shield of Heaven skill. Before the release of this skill, Lions vs Light Dragons/Sheep was still balanced. Yea, I know you're thinking that I got hax LK, he/she can't hit me. But how about you? Can you even stand long minutes of trying to kill a Light mage? They will just recast SoH and heal. And besides, with that kind of LK, an average LK lion won't have a decent amount of damage. Your fast pew pew won't have any effect because it will only be recovered.

Third, before the HV nerf, I can say that I can last long against AP and some HV charms. AP charms can't even land a single hit on me before he/she dies. (Okay, exaggeration. Lol.) And HV types, I can still run around and not get hit (this is if my damage is 0). But you see, due to the HV nerf it has been quite a hard time dealing with these people in PvP.

Still want to make a lion? You still have a chance on other characters not mentioned above but you better have these stats I'm going to mention below.

For Pure Buffalos, you need to have high AC stat (high, meaning hax). Remember, power types can get at least 15k ~ 20k HP. Have you ever done a 14k ~ 18k Double shot on power types? Not close? Yea, I thought so. But Buffalos (and I think every other character) take longer to cast a skill than a lion. So you'll have an edge if your damage is high enough to kill them.

As for Dark Mages, Foxes and other Lions, basically having high LK (higher than them of course) is enough not to get hits from them. And your damage will be fair enough to take out most of their HP and have them delayed because they're going to be healing/using potions. A good time to land another combo.

Pure Buffalos, Dark Mages, Foxes, other Lions, and noobs will be your best target in PvP but I wouldn't want to bully a noob though.

Still, a lot of things have not been mentioned here. And even I, as a Lion, still have lots to learn. Suggestions and non-flammable comments are always welcome and can be a good contribution to everyone's knowledge.
 
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09-18-2008   #2 (permalink)
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HV nerf is the biggest killer for me. You rarely see my lion in pvp anymore simply for the fact it can get hit so easily now. Charms use to take forever to land a hit. Now Im running around pot spamming with my poor tail between my legs, hoping to hell Skunk doest hit or its over >_>
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09-18-2008   #3 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BloodVeil
HV nerf is the biggest killer for me. You rarely see my lion in pvp anymore simply for the fact it can get hit so easily now. Charms use to take forever to land a hit. Now Im running around pot spamming with my poor tail between my legs, hoping to hell Skunk doest hit or its over >_>
That was the same case for me. Definitely a big killer.

So, for people who will make a lion. Please make it hax. Lol. And goodluck!
 
09-18-2008   #4 (permalink)
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funny because when the nerf happend, everyone thought (or atleast some did) that lions would rule and charms would suffer lol
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09-18-2008   #5 (permalink)
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^the easiest way to fight a pure buff is to go melee and hit them with icky/landmine/lucky fist combo.

but of course, all of this is without them getting a skill off
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09-18-2008   #6 (permalink)
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Well, you're right.

I'm not here to brag, but I'm the only lion left that can impact PVP.

With these recent changes, lions are almost obsolete in PVP because you've gotta be #1 to do anything decent.
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09-18-2008   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teuflisch
funny because when the nerf happend, everyone thought (or atleast some did) that lions would rule and charms would suffer lol
I even tried that myself! xD It didn't come across my mind that my HV would drop too. xD
 
09-18-2008   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkillzKillz
lions are almost obsolete in PVP because you've gotta be #1 to do anything decent.
I'd second that. It's either you have hax LK or do massive damage.

-off topic- And how come you don't show yourself when I'm in pvp? D:
 
09-18-2008   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawnee
I'd second that. It's either you have hax LK or do massive damage.

-off topic- And how come you don't show yourself when I'm in pvp? D:
Well, I've been PVPing a lot recently. Gettin kinda bored, and taking a break until I get back to work on TO. That should be soon.


I see that you live in the Philippines and I live in Canada. We are about 12 hours away, so we probably won't see each other in PVP since I play at 4am~11am your time.
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09-19-2008   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkillzKillz
Well, I've been PVPing a lot recently. Gettin kinda bored, and taking a break until I get back to work on TO. That should be soon.


I see that you live in the Philippines and I live in Canada. We are about 12 hours away, so we probably won't see each other in PVP since I play at 4am~11am your time.
Right. xD Even on this timezone, I don't see any decent lion anymore.
 
09-19-2008   #11 (permalink)
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The HV nerf is the only thing that gets my lion raped in PVP...
But frankly he does better than my coon or wizard in PVP any day.

But I've killed bunnies and buffalos with guard, and pure buffalos to boot. (Ganged by three power types + a light mage at the same time is not fun. >_e; )
I've also broken a few light mage's shields, although these were usually tests rather than in real combat. o_o;
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09-19-2008   #12 (permalink)
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I've never brought my lion to PvP...the HV nerf would hurt him, even if i can get him good HP.

PvP = drama so i rarely go there.
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09-19-2008   #13 (permalink)
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PvP is such a OHKO-skill-fest now, it's not friendly for Sense types anymore.
All a Charm really has to do is chuck a card or fart and you're dead, no misses.
I rarely see them even bother with skunking a lion first...


And I feel sorry for them. Gun lions had comparitively low tanking ability to begin with and then the HV nerf ganked them even more. My Hunter Lord is stuck in the same boat and spends more time in PvM now, which is a total switch.

My Thief Master's the one with better PvP survival because she's freakin' invisible 90% of the time. Can't attack the dark dragons, can't survive powers using Guard, can't break all the Shield of Heavens fueled by hax MA, can't make a big enough dent in all the HP charms running around now.

Oh but she survives, no problem.
Just sitting there scratching her butt doing nothing in Hell.




When do Sense types get their hax barrier skill, Ntreev? When?
 
09-19-2008   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NegaRutabaga
PvP is such a OHKO-skill-fest now, it's not friendly for Sense types anymore.
All a Charm really has to do is chuck a card or fart and you're dead, no misses.
I rarely see them even bother with skunking a lion first...


And I feel sorry for them. Gun lions had comparitively low tanking ability to begin with and then the HV nerf ganked them even more. My Hunter Lord is stuck in the same boat and spends more time in PvM now, which is a total switch.

My Thief Master's the one with better PvP survival because she's freakin' invisible 90% of the time. Can't attack the dark dragons, can't survive powers using Guard, can't break all the Shield of Heavens fueled by hax MA, can't make a big enough dent in all the HP charms running around now.

Oh but she survives, no problem.
Just sitting there scratching her butt doing nothing in Hell.




When do Sense types get their hax barrier skill, Ntreev? When?
First line in bold is so true. I wish there was something I can use to change to a Pure Fox. XD

Second line, I think this will never happen (or not anytime soon). As I can see in the Future Trickster Content thread, there is not a single skill for lions that say "Hax barrier. Say QQ no more." And if there was anything like it to ever come to TO, it'll definitely be for Pure Lions. So yea, more cons for a Hybrid then huh?
 
09-19-2008   #15 (permalink)
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I'm still actually curious why ntreev usa decided to hit foxes in particular with a few major nerfs from jto; maybe they thought it would be overpowered but the end result was simply making foxes almost unplayable in certain aspects. landmine used to have full screen range which made it have a purpose to be used even once you get EE, and both shuriken skills didn't have the ap/10 in their formula, making their damage considerably higher
 
09-19-2008   #16 (permalink)
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You can flame me on this one, But i heard a Rumor about a skill for lions that can make them shoot for like 10 times idk if its true or not but i seen it in the "Old Mytrickster" @___@ (not in Blu's Skill)

and My Lion always get kill by Charms and Buffs so thats why i made a mage to get revenge wuhahaha!!!!!
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09-19-2008   #17 (permalink)
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Lions are basically boss killers/pvm thats why they're pretty much garbage in pvp lmao, i can say this because i use to play a lion from beta up till like i quit.
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09-19-2008   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawnee
Right. xD Even on this timezone, I don't see any decent lion anymore.
I heard that lion from wte^_ named [kex1] is pretty good. You might want to check him out. (wink)
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09-19-2008   #19 (permalink)
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But I never see kexnab around :U
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09-19-2008   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
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But I never see kexnab around :U

lol ya... XD
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