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-   -   Jamesie's Guide for: Lions (http://ggftw.com/forum/sense-type-guides/44357-jamesies-guide-lions.html)

Tardar 04-11-2009 07:28 AM

Jamesie's Guide for: Lions
 
Nope .

Tardar 05-09-2009 08:25 AM

-Just in case-

Nakigahara 07-04-2009 03:45 PM

You're off to a good start. Keep going! :)

Tardar 07-07-2009 09:31 AM

I'm writing it in word first.
But I'm also busy with Physics in summer school, so I'm a little slowed down.

Nakigahara 07-07-2009 02:18 PM

That's understandable.

Where should a Lion train around level 70? I have most if not all of the quests done up to level 70 and Path to Oops Wharf is terrible experience now.

Tardar 07-07-2009 04:29 PM

Build graph? And did you go for Lucky 7 or Shooting Spree first?

Nakigahara 07-07-2009 04:45 PM

Oh sorry.

1144 Pure AC Lion with about 135 AC. I'm going for Shooting Spree first but I don't have it. My TM level is only 62 (my base is 72). Although I haven't bought the level 70 MyShop set yet but I plan to very soon and using the MyShop compound stones to put AC on the hat and gun.

Tardar 07-07-2009 05:21 PM

Umm, I think one of the places you should try is Mermaid Field maps. I don't remember which one is the most popular one though.

Nakigahara 07-07-2009 11:48 PM

Thanks. I just trained the Mermaid Field 3 and it was decent experience with a full royal party. One map that someone pointed out to me if I wanted to solo in was Phantom Schoo 2F - Chilly Hallway. Just by myself I was getting .3 per Maiden Ghost compared to the .5 I get from a Water Weed Witch when I'm in a full royal party.

Just food for thought.

Tardar 07-08-2009 01:20 PM

That is a good map, but an even better map would be the small rooms on the first floor of Phantom, the ones with the gun weak Tritches. I believe they are 1-3 and 1-4. Small rooms, and I think they are decent EXP, I don't remember.

SirDurant 10-21-2009 09:53 AM

It's a good start, but it doesn't cover skills or training past about the first hour or two...

I started playing a gunner lion yesterday, and I had no idea they could be so fun ^_^ Anyone who says gunning without Inv. Reload fails appearantly has the reaction time of a snail...it's not hard to still get in every shot standing still if the monster's DX isn't absurd. Anyways, gunners train fast (good damage, probably the highest damage comp rate of any weapon due to being able to comp AC) and aren't that expensive (little to no need for potions, so the only real cost is bullets, which are 5 galder a shot).

I only use the Duck Hat and Keychain. Dumped the rest--no AC bonus. I'm oddly prejudiced AGAINST the duck set, but as lions are pretty much the hardest unfunded characters (supposedly), I decided to allow the pieces that gave me AC.

Opinion check: Pistol Whip/Lucky Punch? It's based off max HP more than LK, so wouldn't that make it a powerful bossing skill? I mean, if bosses can hit you at a distance, what's wrong with walking up and bashing 40% of their health off with a Mastered PW/LP? Or is there something I'm missing here about Lucky Punch that makes it not a good bossing skill? I know the emphasis is on GUNS, but I'm not getting how an attack based on the opponent's max HP isn't a good boss skill...clarify, please?

Also, the Pearl Pistol is Karan's unique, right? (Trying to find a gun with a high number of slots)

Esper 10-21-2009 10:06 AM

Momijii doesn't even actively play TO anymore. That is probably the reason as to why his guide was never completed.

You are wrong about the Lucky Fist skill.
(Enemy's Max HP 10 + LK 8) Power [Power is 440%]
The Enemy's Max HP isn't the total HP, it only calculates the bar you are on.
Let's use Tenter as an example.
Tenter's HP is ~ 23k per bar & my lion's LK [7xx]
23,000 10 = 2,300
700 8 = 5,600
As you can see, LK is the bigger factor within the equation compared to HP.

You are missing the fact that Lucky Fist has an animation time of ~3 seconds before it deals damage. If you time it wrong, that's enough time for you to be banished or possibly hit by a strong skill. The cooldown of the skill doesn't help it either [6 seconds].

Lucky Fist is also a bad skill to use to combo because it's considered a Physical Attack. All bosses begin to increase their physical and magical defense as you lower their HP.

All of these are based off Count, Tenter, and Queen. I could care less about the lower level bosses since they are easy for anyone.


Yes. Pearl Pistol is Karan's unique.
[Pearl Pistol]

AlexInWonderland 10-21-2009 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirDurant (Post 1022016)

Opinion check: Pistol Whip/Lucky Punch? It's based off max HP more than LK, so wouldn't that make it a powerful bossing skill? I mean, if bosses can hit you at a distance, what's wrong with walking up and bashing 40% of their health off with a Mastered PW/LP? Or is there something I'm missing here about Lucky Punch that makes it not a good bossing skill? I know the emphasis is on GUNS, but I'm not getting how an attack based on the opponent's max HP isn't a good boss skill...clarify, please?

The reason why the majority of lions (Such as myself who is a 170 scientist) don't use lucky fist is because of Shield Breaker.
Yes shield breaker, the holy grail of bossing for lions.
Shield breaker drops a monsters resist by 80% at max.
Before using shield breaker I would do around 3k per double shot on Karan I believe. With it on, my damage sky rocketed up to 22k per shot.
I can effectively kill Karan in 3 hits.

SirDurant 10-21-2009 03:56 PM

Okay, that clears things up. Health bars are treated separately, so the only possible viable use at all might be on HP coons if at all.

Also, what the hell? Shield Breaker cuts enemy resists? (Hello EO2 Hexer with Dampen) How does the equation work? Is the 80% cut a linear cut (10% taken -> 90% taken, 100% taken -> 180% taken) or is it based on resistance (100% "resistance" = normal damage, so an 80% cut would mean they take 5x normal)? Also, which elements does it effect? Just guns/melee or all elements? (Thinking Spicy, takes 80% from water, 20% from guns, 10% from anything else IIRC)

Thanks for the clarification, the Wikis aren't that specific.

ShionSinX 10-21-2009 04:15 PM

its the psychal and gun resist. if a monster have 100% gun resist (like, no dmg, immunity etc.) he ll now have 20% resist, that means u ll deal a good dmg, instead of 0 dmg.

lets say a boss in the last HP bar have 80% resist to all dmg. he ll now get the normal dmg.

and if u use a melee attack, the dmg ll be higher at spicy cuz its resist to psychal ll be lowered, but the attr bonus that is not water ll continue the same.

IE: if u deal +1k dmg with ur AP cuz u have a good soil attr, u ll still deal +1k dmg after use the shield breaker, but ur base AP dmg ll be higher.

Zelkyri 10-21-2009 04:16 PM

Shield breaker only affects Gun damage so it has nothing to do with the other melee elements. If a monster absorbs gun damage then shield breaker will null the absorption and you'll be able to deal damage to the monsters, although the damage done to them isn't as high as it would normally deal to a monster that has been broken.
As for resistance like the boss resistance, they still apply but shield breaker makes it so it's much easier to kill them even with the hp bar at red for the bosses.

It's important to remember shield breaker don't actually decrease any stats so the enemy's HV will still affect how much your gun will still do to them.

SirDurant 10-21-2009 04:34 PM

Alright. What happens if you use it on something with neutral or worse gun resist? Does it still have an impact?

Also, how big are the Banish rings on average? I've seen a Chimu's Banish ring (lol, that's puny) and I'm wondering if the boss rings are any bigger. If so, how much bigger (anyone got a screenie)??

Esper 10-21-2009 06:00 PM

If you use Shield Breaker on a neutral monster, the damage you do is going to still increase.
There are no monsters with "worse" gun resist. If the monster is healed whenever you use attacks, it's the gun resist. Using Shield breaker removes the gun resist property to let you deal damage.


Chimu's banish is small because it's not a boss. It's just a spawn to annoy players with a smaller banish.
The actual bosses unique is the same size as Bolster Ballad [mastered] if you ever saw a sheep with one.
Sadly I have no pictures of it.

SirDurant 10-21-2009 07:04 PM

I've seen Bolster Ballad several times. AOE6, about Cleaving Terra size--or roughly the size of the sight circle at night. That's pretty easily escapeable in three seconds...do bosses give any verbal clues before casting?

By "worse resist", I meant would using it on a gunweak monster boost further?

Esper 10-21-2009 07:52 PM

It's easy to run out of Banish if you aren't use any skills or use skills that have a fast animation. Some skills, like Lucky Fist, have a cast time and slows you down. You may or may not make it out of the Banish.

I forgot if the bosses give verbal clues before casting it. I always kill them before they can do anything. x.x

If you use Shield Breaker on a gun weak monster, the damage dealt will still increase.


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