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05-14-2009   #21 (permalink)
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Me personally hate how religion brainwashes people. My religion is my own morals that I've learned through life, and also what my gut feelings tell me is right or wrong.

I like religion for their creative stories and such, but not how they brainwash people and turn their backs on the truth.
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05-14-2009   #22 (permalink)
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Each to his own. I do hope people just respect each other even if they have differing opinions.

I'm a Catholic. I live in a predominantly Catholic country with its own share of both saints and hypocrites. I have once been an agnostic, but made an informed choice to become a Catholic.
I was educated by a religious order frequently excommunicated in the past for being too outspoken and liberal. They have taught me both the good and the bad, and always responded to my questions even if the answers weren't pretty.

I have come to realize that what a person does with his religion is his own choice. The institution can only offer theories, but the person must practice it properly. Even the institution makes mistakes about practice, same as the (fragile) people who compose it. I suppose that is why I can proudly say that I am a Catholic even though our history is tainted by bloodshed.

I have a Muslim friend. Back in the 9/11 days, people were giving her a hard time. She could have taken off her veil to hide the fact and avoid harassment, but she wore it proudly. "Muslims have killed many, but they are misguided. Our doctrine teaches tolerance and peace. This is not true jihad." It's true; we've studied Islam, but the Muslim name has been tainted forever. It still does not make it wrong. Alas, some idiot Catholics (Jesus said to love thy neighbor, GFD IT) do not understand this, same as some idiot Muslims think they praise Allah by running into a crowd wearing a bomb.

There is just a general lack of understanding about religion in general, I believe. I suppose the more zealous fanatics think that the "apostolic mission" includes arguing their way into converting a non-believer, more's the pity. It's just... No. People don't get it.

It's really simple. If a person has chosen differently, LAY OFF. Just... Back off. You can advise a person to do the right thing (return a lost wallet, let the granny have this taxi) but you cannot force a person on his knees to bow and pray (or tell him that his religion is wrong, wrong, wrong). Because, well... Even an atheist can be a good person. Even Catholics and Muslims can be wonderful people.

My two cents.



(EDIT: If anyone harasses me in the forum or via PM about being a Catholic again, I will get rid of you. YES, YOU. Do not try to convert me, or put me through another Inquisition. Respect me, and I will respect you.)
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05-14-2009   #23 (permalink)
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This is a good point that the fanatics always seem to miss: there's no such thing as a true religion, only true followers. No matter how many positive traits a religion develops (like charity, honesty, kindness, mildness, endurance, and devotion), the religion will grow until the screwups have enough numbers to cause significant trouble or splinter off entirely. A good example was a group of American colonist pilgrims who thought sex was evil... and their movement died with them. Anyone who's affiliated with their branch of Christianity must facepalm whenever they learn of something equally stupid. The fact that not one religious organization has been perfect and squeaky clean has led many to believe that there simply isn't a religious order that's worthy to believe in. Very few people like bearing the burdens of the centuries of screw ups an old religious organization has done, so religion is sometimes kept secret, or if you are a newcomer, completely avoided altogether.

This is a continuing trend that contributes to many of today's professed atheists: they believe there is no God because no organization on the planet as a whole has managed to give proper representation. When a person new to faith is looking for a true religion, and practically all of them are doing something wrong, they come to the quick conclusion that religion is wrong. The deeper answer is far more complex, and like you mentioned, it's the individual that really makes a religion what it is. Believing in your faith, no matter what it is, and promoting good qualities that benefit society makes you a better person. Doing all these things and being excommunicated because you called Thomas More a murderer is just politics, solidarity, and a bloody shame.

This is really what I dislike most about all organized religion: no matter how honest, clean, and giving you are, if you disagree with the old bastards at the top who run the show, you are going to be kicked out. If you helped to carry 200 war refugees across the border, lost a foot while doing so, fed them for the next 5 years at the edge of a jungle, taught them your religion, and get found with a condom, the old guys at the top will call you worse than Satan or make sure none of your deeds get published. So in closing, if you can stomach the religious organizations of the world enough to look past it, you might be able to find a good religion.

Or you could become a closet worshiper because you don't want to put up with all the crap. Contrary to popular belief, God will judge the people running the show far worse than a few disillusioned followers 8D

Last edited by VorpalBunny; 05-14-2009 at 05:43 AM.
 
05-23-2009   #24 (permalink)
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This is why I'm Athiest. x.x
 
05-24-2009   #25 (permalink)
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Sigh... people like these are the reason why I'm so irate about religion. My parents are leaning towards extremism themselves.

So there's a TV Programme about different countries, races and their cultures... and what does my mom say when she sees them performing their cultural dances?

"Oh I pity these poor people... they are lost and do not see the light. I hope God has mercy on them."

Makes my blood boil like CRAZY
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05-24-2009   #26 (permalink)
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I find it funny extremists even say bad things about other religions. Without a doubt, the most inferior form of religion on the planet is radical extremist.
 
05-25-2009   #27 (permalink)
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Yeah, I don't see the point of extremism, since you're basically closing walls around yourself and becoming like a rock... like that Egyptian pharaoh in the book of Exodus >_> *coughcough*

Ugh, why can't people just respect other people for their beliefs instead of trying to force them into a religion? Even if the religion might be true, people who are forced to believe but they truly do not won't be helped at all :/

-Looks at the Bible and sees stories of people who have been attempted to be forced into a religion-
Hmm... I smell hypocrisy.
 
05-27-2009   #28 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VorpalBunny
After arguing that the past is the past, she wanted to show that the modern church is no longer what it used to be. This was hardly a valid argument, as Thomas More, one of William Tyndale's lead prosecutors, and overall Catholic attack dog, was declared as a Patron Saint of Statesmen and Politicians by Pope John Paul II in 2000.
Thomas More wasn't an overall Catholic attack dog. Last time I read, wasn't he a Roman Catholic? o.O

I was recently approached by Christian promoters. One of them talked to me, obviously subtly hinting that i should join them. I shook them off subtly , but you could hear people laughing at them for promoting. Sure they may seem weird, but i wouldn't laugh at a disabled person just cause their weird.

Though i will lol at one of their questions:

"Have you ever wondered why so many people in this world are christian?"

It's cause many people are - insert your own thought's here-
 
05-27-2009   #29 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChaosReaper
Thomas More wasn't an overall Catholic attack dog. Last time I read, wasn't he a Roman Catholic? o.O
He was more or less a gangster for the church who got anyone that disagreed with them killed, exiled, or thrown into prison. For his glorious work of putting harmless people to death to further the power and influence of the church, he's now exalted as a saint 8D
 
05-27-2009   #30 (permalink)
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Well, I believe in God. I'm not very religious, but I am very spiritual. You can question my belief in God, but I won't question your atheist/agnostic beliefs. The main problem with people who are religious (in most cases [not all]) is that they try to force their own beliefs down other people's throats, which only causes confrontation and anger as Vorpal explained.

Religion can be good as long as you keep your beliefs to your own self. Even spiritual people can be annoying by trying to convince atheist/agnostic people there is a God, which I do agree is very wrong. It shouldn't be what other people believe in, but what you believe in.
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Last edited by Jon; 05-27-2009 at 11:50 AM.
 
05-27-2009   #31 (permalink)
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Pope getting you down?
Need someone to inspire you?
Call Battle Pope, hes kickin' demon ass and takin' names!

Figured I'd inject some humor into the thread.
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05-28-2009   #32 (permalink)
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Quite a fail attempt, Metty.
 
05-28-2009   #33 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yumiko
Quite a fail attempt, Metty.
Love to see you do better with the material available.
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