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Beauti 06-12-2008 03:27 PM

Basic Prediction and Counter Guides (mostly vs Runners)
 
PvP Basic Prediction and Counter Guide

Hi there as the title says this is a PvP Basic and the most simplest prediction guide that mostly contains prediction steps vs; runners, runners x spammers, and some advance predictions. I don't think that there is a prediction guide yet so I'll post my own here. Mostly I noticed that my tactics for this guide is really similar to chess playing so I’ll be using chess pieces as terms (even though I suck at chess :D).

This guide will being using tia skills since I have been using only tia for awhile now. Mostly this is a basic guide for noobs and middle class players. By the way, if you use this too often, people will think of a counter to break these tactics I have. You could use this as a base and start your own prediction thinking. These prediction already exist looong time ago. I just put them into my own words :D. I do not own or really ‘make’ the counters.

Note: This prediction guide really can't help you if you're vs. an 'evil' pro that can predict your movements and do crazy combos that can do like 2k+ damage (ex. A high lvl Tia doing a less decay Backstab combo in free, those hurt :( ) and some pros have their own style of luring and attacking. Mostly I think you pros out there don't really need this prediction guide since you have your own ways to predict and lure. This guide is MAINLY for vsing runners and spammers, there aren't really any tactics to stop pros that can predict 3 steps ahead.

Mostly this guide is based on my PvP experience, and from tips I got from pros when I get my ass whooped :D If you don't think this Guide is any help, don't read it. I'm trying to show what I do and don't do when I fight these types of people. This prediction guide is basic on MY information on how these players react and play. I have been PvPing for about 4 months now so I see alot of these things that happens. If you do think this is a helpful guide, and if you all think that this sucks, please tell me so I can improve/remove it. Ok enough of my gibberish lets get this party started.

Note:I'm not using screenshot since it's going to take some time to edit and the whole thing is too big, so I'll be using Paint to draw the tactics, don't mind the ugliness :D. Mostly this PvP guide is using City Area as the place to battle, and it's 1vs1 tips.

(Note: since I don't know how the heck I can get my paint images onto here (the insert image, you need a URL which my picture isn't on the web) I'm going to put the pictures in Crunchyroll and URL through that)

Table of Contents

_The Chaser/The Offensive Players_
The Corner Huggers [The Knight]
The Open Area Runners [The Pawn]

_The Observer/The Defensive Players_
The waiting [The Rook] (aka The eagle)

_Advanced_
Castle the King [Castle]
The lure [The Bishop]
The Box [The Queen]
_Extra_
_Credits_[Credits]


Basics

_The Chaser/The Offensive Players_


The Corner Huggers [The Knight]

(Reason why called “The Knight”: As you all know, in chess the knight moves in an L shaped. This tactic looks like it’s in an L shape. Noob runners that run and sometimes spam some skills now and then tend to run to the corners to lure you and when they reached to the corners(the easy part to notice), they stop, and turn around and fire. Sometimes they move from the middle and stop and turn around. It is really unusual to see a runner stop running. It's so easy to notice that they are going to attack. If they stop, there are 3 main reasons why they stop (runner's reasons) A) stupid enough to stand there and let you kill them B) charging Mana or what cheap healers do when you clearly say don't do, Heal C) Attack with a Skill or D) the last opinion, AFK

Just follow the Pictures below and you’ll be ok.
http://img50.imageshack.us/img50/2640/thehorseye7.png

Note: The white circle is you and the black circle is the opponent. If they fire straight dash diagonal to avoid and charge at the opponent, if they fire diagonally try to go below them and attack up. If you’re so slow and unlucky that they manage to run to the left, use this tactic again or use [The Pawn] tactic.

If you are stupid enough to charge into a healer that is already turn towards you, and you’re like 20cm away from them, unless you’re confident in hitting the healer before she attacks, prepare yourself for 3-4 crescents fly at you. To avoid the homing attacks refer to the [Castle the King] section.


The Open Area Runners [The Pawn]

Reason for calling it “The Pawn” Well, pawns all attack diagonal from their position is like what’s going to happen here. Mostly I don’t think you should do this too often because it’s a low chance of really getting a hit.

For me, there are 3 types of ways to use ‘Pawns’. One is when you opponents at the corner, second is when your opponents at the middle parts of the wall and you’re against the wall too, and third is when they are against the middle wall and you’re in front of them.

Corner

If you combo or push them into a corner, the immediate reaction from that person is to get away from you. If they know they can’t do anything in the corner because you’re to close, they’ll try to run to the other corner. Mostly when runners are trapped in the corner, the runner will tend to run to the open areas. This is where tia’s backstab will do the trick. Enjoy looking at your opponent’s back and stab them. If you’re abit slow, try to chase them and if they turn around, do the [The Knight] tactic. If they try to fight back, well, go to the [Bishop] section for details.

http://img107.imageshack.us/img107/9...ncornerpl3.png


Wall and Wall

If you’re both against the wall and they try to run away, mostly runners run into the open areas of the map so there is a higher chance of being able to escape you (about 60% of runners do this) At that time you could use backstab diagonally. If they run away from you, you could just use backstab at them really fast or else you’ll fail (20% of runners do this). If they run diagonally away from you, there is nothing you could do but chase them (20%). Mostly I never have seen a player that runs diagonally towards you so I can’t really say anything about it, but if they do just turn towards them and fire/Aass/aas.

http://img50.imageshack.us/img50/715...andwallgc9.png

Wall and in Front

This one is simple enough. It’s a 50-50% out of 70% chance you’ll get it right and a 30% chance they’ll fight back.

http://img50.imageshack.us/img50/564...infrontfb7.png
By beautiii

The Observer/Defensive Player[The Rook] aka the Eagle


The Waiting
Reason this is called the ‘Rook’ is because it goes straight towards the enemies. This one should have really have been in the ‘Advance’ section but there needs to be a Defensive part right? Mostly, if you’re a good observer, you’re deadly. If you don’t tend to chase after your opponent, follow these steps instead of [The Knight] too often. You could just wait in the middle and maybe use [The Queen] tactic to scare them and get them into place. Just wait in the middle and let them spam all they want while using [Castle the King] to avoid the homing and attacks. And when they run out of mana, act like you’re chasing them so they can’t recharge and observe their movements while doing that. And when the right opportunity comes, strike them with all you got.

http://img107.imageshack.us/img107/9007/thewaitpx9.png

The green is your waiting area, and the white is the runner’s ring.




Advance

Castling [Castle]

I really don’t knowhow to do this in chess but it makes the king swap places with the castle to avoid attacks. This is just a normal ‘avoid the attacks’ type of thing but some people I don’t know why, but they just don’t know how to even avoid fire balls and ice rain when they are at the end of the range. This move is just a simple move to the right or left of the ranged attacks and ride the wave to your opponent. This could be a lesson on how to avoid some homing things (fire orbs and crescents)

http://img50.imageshack.us/img50/700...thekingmw4.png

The Lure [The Bishop]

This is almost the same thing as [Castle the King] but it avoid the opponent that physical tries to come in contact with you. Basically it is just to lure your opponent to the place where you are standing. For example, a tia that slides always goes to the area where you last stand and aass you. The trick is to act like you're about to be slide into/at and when shes about to slide you do what the red arrows tell you to do which means to dash out of the way and turn around to the tia and start your combo. This is almost like doing healer's "Dodge" skill and turn around to start aas, this tactic is just basically you move on you're own and making the enemy at the location of where you were standing and attack them.
Note: This tactic/skill is really hard to pull off, only experienced players that are good with timing, skills, and other things are really able to pull this trick off.

http://img107.imageshack.us/img107/8...ebishopyy2.png
The blue lines are the sliding areas of the tia.


The Box [The Queen]

This is what I am really good at. I can’t really explain this in words, but it is like getting the opponent to the right place. Like if your playing chess, and you have a queen left (which can move in one direction, any space) and your opponent has a King left, the good way (my way) to do is to trap them into a corner. It’s almost the same thing as in PvP to get them into a right place. These couple of images will show you what I mean. These are examples situations.

http://img107.imageshack.us/img107/1999/thequeenbq9.png

In these images there is an AFKer in your team and has 0 hp. Your opponent wants to kill him. You want to protect him so you get in the way. The opponent knows you’re strong so he is afraid of you.

1. He tries to run to the right but is stopped by you.
2. He tries to go down, by you intercepted him.
3. You charge at him and since he is afraid of you so he moves back.
4. he has no where to run so he runs up, while you run up (this is like the Pawn)

This is what I mean by boxing him. You are able to seal his movements and is able to control where he moves.

This concludes my prediction guide for now. There are still more things that I didn’t include but I’m too tired to write them.

I am writing a guide for how I see seigs move during a situation(my point of view of course) :D It is about 40% finished, still need some more images and information gathering.

EXTRA INFO

Now here is something I want to say to all the sliders out there, DON'T EVER TRY TO SLIDE ANOTHER PRO TIA!! :( I was before called "The self-admit Slider" which I call myself The Spam Slider :D (since I replace dash with sliding, and i never walk which means I 90% of my 'walking' during battles are slides). I learn my lesson From Sc**l*T**r to never slide into a pro tia T.T. It hurts. That's why mostly I use "the Bishop" and "the Queen" to reach my opponents. I still do slide but I slide 75% less for tias.

Another tip that I find myself useful (my point of view), don't walk. Unless you're doing "The Rook" or you're confident with your abilities or you have something up your sleeves, don't try to walk for pros or spammers. You're just like a duck waiting there to be shot at. This is what I mostly think, Walking = Death

Credits[Credits]
- Me, Beauti, for writing this long essay. I never took ANY information from any guides. I just wrote what I experienced.
- all the runners giving me all your patterns so I can make this guide
- the pros that told me useful tips while killing me in PvP
- my friends F*ll*nB**** and T*k*s*i*ama*o*to for telling me to PvP when I was scared to.
-imageshack for helping me with the pictures
-'Ap*lo**z*' for telling me to use Imageshack T.T You saved me
- and you for reading this

If you need any information, or tips, please ask me, I’ll maybe be in the PvP war room in Balance and sometimes in Free (but try not to whisper to me, I'm always busy pvping) If you want to make your own guide using this, please ask me first. I’ll accept it if you’re not mean :D. And to all those haters out there that is reading this, If this guide doesn’t help you, TOO BAD, find another guide. Thank you for reading this.

Beauti 06-12-2008 03:42 PM

Sorry but im not done yet, the stupid images aren't coming out
Update: Phew, The images are coming out now.
Btw this is what is used for basic runners and middle players. These really wouldn't work on Pros. I think only [The bishop] would really help out in the future. I know there are some errors, but deal with it, i'll try to fix them up soon.

andyfoxxiv 06-12-2008 05:48 PM

Still reading it but nicely done beauti.

Beauti 06-12-2008 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andyfoxxiv (Post 306438)
Still reading it but nicely done beauti.

Yay, at least I have 1 good reply ^^ All the 4 months of experiences didn't go to waste. :)

tommy00X 06-12-2008 07:32 PM

HOLY LONG!!!!! lol
nice guide its really good for the beginners

LuCkY 06-12-2008 07:49 PM

O_O
I am very impressed =O (hi beauti^^)
however i don't agree with "the box" if AFKer has 0hp and.. he is afk. i would rather sacrifice them so i can get them in combo =O

Beauti 06-12-2008 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LuCkY (Post 306696)
O_O
I am very impressed =O (hi beauti^^)
however i don't agree with "the box" if AFKer has 0hp and.. he is afk. i would rather sacrifice them so i can get them in combo =O

(HI ABUSER) Lol that is why I first put at the top of the picture, "example of a situation" on top of it xD This is just an example of how to 'control' you're opponent, I had some troubles thinking of a reason to control your enemies. At first there was no afker but I had to think of a reason why the runner is on-the-move. (Btw this took me 6 hrs to finish (I did it all in Microsoft Word and then I copied and paste :D) "The box" or "The Queen" isn't really about "protecting the afker", I rather use him as a homing human shield :D, I am just trying to explain why and how handy "The Queen" is.

Kirikaze 06-12-2008 08:27 PM

Beautifully done ^^

"Castle the King" (which is actually call castling btw) and "The lure"s image seems to be quite confusing IMO, maybe you can work a bit on that. "The waiting" is a simple chess concept that, it is often to your advantage to control the centre area of the board, so you piece is in a more flexible position than your oppnent. Hope that helps.

Also consider adding how skills might come into play (i.e. shock traps, moon fog, etc)

Good job, keep it up (>_o)b

Beauti 06-12-2008 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirikaze (Post 306829)
Beautifully done ^^

"Castle the King" (which is actually call castling btw) and "The lure"s image seems to be quite confusing IMO, maybe you can work a bit on that. "The waiting" is a simple chess concept that, it is often to your advantage to control the centre area of the board, so you piece is in a more flexible position than your oppnent. Hope that helps.

Also consider adding how skills might come into play (i.e. shock traps, moon fog, etc)

Good job, keep it up (>_o)b

Ty for the word, I'll update it now.

And this is why I said " this guide is for beginners and middle class players and the word "BASIC" in the title" xD. I could even write another guide just for "Rooking" and "Queening" by using things like Shock Trap or Nados to your enemies. (On second thought, I think I will make a guide later on on these things. It depends on my mood and time too. If I am too lazy, I wouldn't make it)

OK, I'll try to explain "The Lure" or aka 'The Bishop' if you don't get it. Basically it is just to lure your opponent to the place where you are standing. For example, a tia that slides always goes to your area and aass you. The trick is to act like you're about to be slide into and when shes about to slide you do what the red arrows tell you to do which means to dash out of the way and turn around to the tia and start your combo. This is almost like doing healer's "Dodge" skill and turn around to start aas, this tactic is you move on you're own and making the enemy at the location of where you were standing. I can't put another circle on the place you were standing because it would make the grey and the black circles mix together and make the picture more confusing. ( I going to copy and paste what I just said to the lure section :D.

Excalibur 06-13-2008 06:22 AM

Wow, extremely interesting since I have trouble with runners. I'm reading it right now.

Beauti 06-13-2008 08:35 PM

o come on, more comments please, negatives ones, postive ones, at least say something T.T ( and I know what you people thinking, you're going to say just "Hi") xD

riceburner4540 06-13-2008 08:50 PM

Something T.T

What do you want people to say? Looks like you spent a lot of time on it but pretty much everything detailed in the guide should be second nature to people who PvP regularly. Your guide deals with the simplest of mind games. If your opponent has any semblance of skill, much of this would be obsolete.

Beauti 06-13-2008 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by riceburner4540 (Post 308903)
Something T.T

What do you want people to say? Looks like you spent a lot of time on it but pretty much everything detailed in the guide should be second nature to people who PvP regularly. Your guide deals with the simplest of mind games. If your opponent has any semblance of skill, much of this would be obsolete.

Ouch that hurts. :o :( (the simple mind games hurt the most :D)
oh well, I'm used to it :D since you said this is second nature, I'll try to make an advance guide vs pro sieg/maybe tias :D but if this new guide sucks, don't blame me :D (note: this new guide would be based on the information I get from battling some pro siegs and spying on them (btw I'll tell you in the room if I am spying or not.) Maybe this new guide will be up in another few days/weeks. Wish me luck! Btw If you think I am trying to make an enemy outta you, i'm not, I'm too chicken to do so :D) (IM PROUD OF BEING WEAK <3) Tanks btw for inspiring me to make a new guide.

Hawk 06-13-2008 09:59 PM

Nice pictures, these tricks seem pretty regular though.

I'd suggest changing the "noob" to "newbs."

Beauti 06-14-2008 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hawk (Post 308977)
Nice pictures, these tricks seem pretty regular though.

I'd suggest changing the "noob" to "newbs."

Thats why I wrote Basic o.o and I write noob like that :D btw I'm making an advance one vs sieg and tias right now, still gathering info. though and writing it up

cherrypandah 06-14-2008 08:17 AM

wow gj (msg to short)

Deverse 06-30-2008 11:26 AM

Wow, but what if you ran by a pro 'comboing' runner O_o
Now that'd be heck

Beauti 06-30-2008 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deverse (Post 331452)
Wow, but what if you ran by a pro 'comboing' runner O_o
Now that'd be heck

Well, this guide is just for runners/spammers only, there are exceptions in the world you no :p

Souljah 07-14-2008 06:16 AM

This guide will help me alot with mage runners. It's going to take some time decipher your tactics though lol. Awesome guide from what I've read.

lazybum 07-16-2008 08:41 AM

wow that mustve taken a lot of work O.o

Interesting... Shall read through this and pick up some tips when i have time ^^

gj


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