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01-19-2012   #21 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yukipyon
I don't think that applies in this case, especially when the MU employees themselves were aware of, and even participated and profited from, said illegal activity.
I'm confused. How does a fact not apply? I didn't have a large amount of files stored personally, mostly just old newspaper comics, but my cousin lost all his model backups for his 3D design classes.
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01-19-2012   #22 (permalink)
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Facts do apply. That's why the US Government shut the site down.
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01-19-2012   #23 (permalink)
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i just used it yesterday ohwell so can they just rename themselve and start anew or they are gone forever...
 
01-19-2012   #24 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yukipyon
No no, that wasn't aimed towards you. I meant the people who are complaining about losing their premium pirating accounts. Sorry if I wasn't being clear.



I don't think that applies in this case, especially when the MU employees themselves were aware of, and even participated and profited from, said illegal activity.
Megaupload did have a borderline retarded way of dealing with illegal content, but the HOO RAH USA USA LET'S DELETE ****ING EVERYTHING way the government went about handling things was stupid. They could have given some warning, perhaps had people with premium accounts get their money refunded.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dread
i just used it yesterday ohwell so can they just rename themselve and start anew or they are gone forever...
They're arresting everyone behind Megaupload, even the graphic designer. You can expect chances of it coming back to be very slim. You can probably expect a bunch of other file sharing websites to follow in its wake.
 
01-19-2012   #25 (permalink)
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Well, if you want to blame anyone, blame the people running Megaupload. Due to their questionable and/or illegal actions, the legit users also suffer with them.
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01-19-2012   #26 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yukipyon
Well, if you want to blame anyone, blame the people running Megaupload. Due to their questionable and/or illegal actions, the legit users also suffer with them.
Uh, no, you'd blame the people responsible for uploading those uploaded files. Megaupload does delete stuff that's blatantly copyrighted, but it's near impossible to control and monitor every single file that passes through them considering their traffic.

This is just plain censorship. Megaupload was taken down without trial or warning; this instance hugely undermines the due process, no matter how "deserving" the punishment is.

Last edited by mamoru; 01-19-2012 at 10:03 PM.
 
01-19-2012   #27 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justice
Megaupload did have a borderline retarded way of dealing with illegal content, but the HOO RAH USA USA LET'S DELETE ****ING EVERYTHING way the government went about handling things was stupid. They could have given some warning, perhaps had people with premium accounts get their money refunded.
For starters, who knows how many under-the-table warnings Megaupload was given. I think it's only fair though that other criminals should be given warnings too. "The jury finds you guilty of murder, here's a warning never to do it again." Sure, deleting everything was a bit rash, however let's imagine how long it'd take to go through everything that was on Megaupload to determine what was and what wasn't stolen/pirated. If anything, paying for Megaupload lumps you along with the arrested folks as you're basically funding their pirating efforts (what idiot doesn't know of all the stolen stuff on MU?).

@orphan: Can't monitor every file that gets uploaded? Then maybe they should have thought of a system that allowed them to catch copyright materials before they were uploaded. The fact that they couldn't filter every file was their own fault and that lead to their demise.
Who says they won't be given a trial? Do we not arrest murderers before we give them a trial? Do we not arrest other criminals before we give them a trial?
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Last edited by Tardar; 01-19-2012 at 10:09 PM.
 
01-19-2012   #28 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yukipyon
I don't think that applies in this case, especially when the MU employees themselves were aware of, and even participated and profited from, said illegal activity.
Sure it does. You asked why people are getting pissed, and it's a legitimate reason.
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01-19-2012   #29 (permalink)
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There is no way to keep a filesharing site 100% legal. It won't work. That's the nature of the internet. You CANNOT monitor the internet, you CANNOT police it, it's too massive, it evolves too fast. I don't doubt there's illegal stuff on Megaupload at all, since I've seen some. But I also know they DO delete what they can. It wasn't like they gave the thumbs up to illegal content.

The same logic being used for Megaupload can be applied to something like...oh, I don't know, YOUTUBE. You should know Youtube DOES try to delete illegal content, or muting the sound. But you know what? It still exists on Youtube. There's too many uploads. Too many ways to get around it. Well, since there's illegal stuff on Youtube, let's shut it down too! Yeah, there's ton of legit stuff (Just like Megaupload!), but there's also some illegal stuff, so let's arrest the owners and completely shut their site down!

Now apply that logic to nearly anything on the internet that allows you to share data. Boom, just about every site should be taken down. The government and the corporations are just being jerks about this.
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01-19-2012   #30 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mitchi
Sure it does. You asked why people are getting pissed, and it's a legitimate reason.
You have only yourself to blame if you pick a site that knowingly commits illegal activities. It's like leaving your car unlocked for an extended period of time in St. Louis (you're a native resident of STL). You come back and it's gone-- now who's fault is that?

@RK: The average internet person won't be able to proliferate stolen content from YouTube as easily as a file-sharing site like Megaupload.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Megaupload's Indictment
1. In practice, the "vast majority" of users do not have any significant long term private storage capability. Continued storage is dependent upon regular downloads of the file occurring. Files not downloaded are rapidly removed in most cases, whereas popular downloaded files are retained.

2. Because a small proportion of users pay for storage, the business is dependent upon advertising. Adverts are primarily viewed when files are downloaded and the business model is therefore not based upon storage but upon maximizing downloads.

3. Persons indicted have "instructed individual users how to locate links to infringing content on the Mega Sites ... [and] ... have also shared with each other comments from Mega Site users demonstrating that they have used or are attempting to use the Mega Sites to get infringing copies of copyrighted content."

4. Persons indicted, unlike the public, are not reliant upon links to stored files, but can search the internal database directly. It is claimed they have "searched the internal database for their associates and themselves so that they may directly access copyright-infringing content".

5. A comprehensive takedown method is in use to identify child pornography, but not deployed to remove infringing content. (item 24)

6. Infringing users did not have their accounts terminated, and the defendants "made no significant effort to identify users who were using the Mega Sites or services to infringe copyrights, to prevent the uploading of infringing copies of copyrighted materials, or to identify infringing copies of copyrighted works" (item 55-56)

7. An incentivizing program was adopted encouraging the upload of "popular" files in return for
payments to successful uploaders. (item 69e et al)

8. Defendants explicitly discussed evasion and infringement issues (69i-l)
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Last edited by Tardar; 01-19-2012 at 10:21 PM.
 
01-19-2012   #31 (permalink)
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I just hope that dropbox doesn't get ****ed with, I've got stuff backed up there.
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01-19-2012   #32 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesie
For starters, who knows how many under-the-table warnings Megaupload was given. I think it's only fair though that other criminals should be given warnings too. "The jury finds you guilty of murder, here's a warning never to do it again." Sure, deleting everything was a bit rash, however let's imagine how long it'd take to go through everything that was on Megaupload to determine what was and what wasn't stolen/pirated. If anything, paying for Megaupload lumps you along with the arrested folks as you're basically funding their pirating efforts (what idiot doesn't know of all the stolen stuff on MU?).
So wait, paying for MU, even if you used it for completely legitimate reasons like the vast majority of megaupload users did, makes you a criminal?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesie
@orphan: Can't monitor every file that gets uploaded? Then maybe they should have thought of a system that allowed them to catch copyright materials before they were uploaded. The fact that they couldn't filter every file was their own fault and that lead to their demise.
Who says they won't be given a trial? Do we not arrest murderers before we give them a trial? Do we not arrest other criminals before we give them a trial?
It'd be absolutely absurd and nearly impossible for MU to just scan every single file on a website that massive. Not mention it would be a total violation of the privacy of MU's users. Also, I didn't know that murder and sharing files online were of the same severity.
 
01-19-2012   #33 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justice
So wait, paying for MU, even if you used it for completely legitimate reasons like the vast majority of megaupload users did, makes you a criminal?
Firstly, how you are so ignorant about a site's reputation as a mean of distributing pirated materials is beyond me. If you're paying for something, you should at least know what's going on.

Also, 81 million unique visitors. The vast majority of those 81 million users had no intentions of downloading pirated/copyright content? Oh please-- spare me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Justice
Also, I didn't know that murder and sharing files online were of the same severity.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesie
Who says they won't be given a trial? Do we not arrest murderers before we give them a trial? Do we not arrest other criminals before we give them a trial?
Bolded statement. But even still, I can't think of any crime that you can be charged with America (maybe aside from traffic crime) that you're let off with just a warning. You may not go to jail, but that doesn't mean you aren't reprimanded with fines.
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01-19-2012   #34 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesie
You have only yourself to blame if you pick a site that knowingly commits illegal activities. It's like leaving your car unlocked for an extended period of time in St. Louis (you're a native resident of STL). You come back and it's gone-- now who's fault is that?
Okay, let's use a smaller and more...familiar situation. This is an extreme example, of course. In the wonderful world of Trickster, trading and selling MyShop items is against the ToS, and in essence, illegal. There are people who do that on ggFTW on a regular basis. The nice people who run Trickster decided to file a report and ggFTW gets shut down. You're basically saying that the people who don't even play Trickster but visit ggFTW due to whatever reason is at fault for visiting this place and deserve their accounts on here terminated.

How about we use a different example? Trickster bans everyone due to the transactions that are against the ToS. Will you blame the people who have never bought MyShop with Galders? Can those people be angry that they get banned?

"Nope! You know very well people do this, it's your fault that you're banned. It can't be helped. You should've known better."

How ridiculous does sound to you?
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01-19-2012   #35 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orphan
Uh, no, you'd blame the people responsible for uploading those uploaded files. Megaupload does delete stuff that's blatantly copyrighted, but it's near impossible to control and monitor every single file that passes through them considering their traffic.
Yes, the pirates themselves are also to blame for this, but that doesn't mean that Megaupload is free of any guilt. Just read an article that details Megaupload's shutdown and you'll see they're pretty much responsible for this too.

Quote:
This is just plain censorship. Megaupload was taken down without trial or warning; this instance hugely undermines the due process, no matter how "deserving" the punishment is.
Uh, Megaupload was a site of pretty large illegal, file-sharing activities. It's not censorship, because as far as I know, I don't think the the US government gives the right to commit copyright infringement and digital piracy. It's really just everyday law enforcement.

Besides, as mentioned before, the people behind Megaupload are being arrested at the moment. They'll get their trial.
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01-19-2012   #36 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesie
Firstly, how you are so ignorant about a site's reputation as a mean of distributing pirated materials is beyond me. If you're paying for something, you should at least know what's going on.

Also, 81 million unique visitors. The vast majority of those 81 million users had no intentions of downloading pirated/copyright content? Oh please-- spare me.
I never feigned ignorance of MU being a pirate's paradise. I'll admit that I even used it for shadier things myself (even though you'll probably call the cops on me). But, yes, I believe the vast majority of those 81 million users used MU legally. Why? Because most people aren't internet savvy enough to know where they can get free stuff on the internet. Yes, there's people who paid for premium accounts on MU so entire series and discographies, but I bet you there were way more people who owned premium accounts just so they could use it for storage space, their jobs or even - GASP - sharing things legally.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yukipyon
Uh, Megaupload was a site of pretty large illegal, file-sharing activities. It's not censorship, because as far as I know, I don't think the the US government gives the right to commit copyright infringement and digital piracy. It's really just everyday law enforcement.
It's everyday enforcement until you realize that Megaupload isn't even within America's jurisdiction

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01-19-2012   #37 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justice
It's everyday enforcement until you realize that Megaupload isn't even within America's jurisdiction
I read somewhere that the .com domain is managed by the United States, and I believe that may be why the Feds went with this action.
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01-19-2012   #38 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yukipyon
Uh, Megaupload was a site of pretty large illegal, file-sharing activities. It's not censorship, because as far as I know, I don't think the the US government gives the right to commit copyright infringement and digital piracy. It's really just everyday law enforcement.

Besides, as mentioned before, the people behind Megaupload are being arrested at the moment. They'll get their trial.
That's too bad none of the people who were arrested are US citizens. Not to mention Megaupload is based in Hong Kong. No one is saying Megaupload is faultless; I'm pointing out that this is largely an abuse of power on the US's side -- Megaupload is being made an example. The domain is not enough to arrest foreigners. Also, taking down one of the most popular websites in existence is far from an everyday law enforcement.
 
01-19-2012   #39 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orphan
That's too bad none of the people who were arrested are US citizens. Not to mention Megaupload is based in Hong Kong. No one is saying Megaupload is faultless; I'm pointing out that this is largely an abuse of power on the US's side -- Megaupload is being made an example. The domain is not enough to arrest foreigners. Also, taking down one of the most popular websites in existence is far from an everyday law enforcement.

Maybe you didn't read the part where it says that Megaupload also has servers (which contain illegal material) located in the United States (and even Canada).

Maybe you also missed this little fact right here:

Quote:
Originally Posted by arstechnica
...The case is a major one, involving international cooperation between the US, Hong Kong, the Netherlands, the UK, Germany, Canada, and the Philippines. In addition to the arrests, 20 search warrants were executed today in multiple countries.
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01-19-2012   #40 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Justice
I never feigned ignorance of MU being a pirate's paradise. I'll admit that I even used it for shadier things myself (even though you'll probably call the cops on me). But, yes, I believe the vast majority of those 81 million users used MU legally. Why? Because most people aren't internet savvy enough to know where they can get free stuff on the internet. Yes, there's people who paid for premium accounts on MU so entire series and discographies, but I bet you there were way more people who owned premium accounts just so they could use it for storage space, their jobs or even - GASP - sharing things legally.
You referring to a user who pays for the service-- not you. Even if the users of MU were using it properly, not even MU was designed to be used "properly." I bring back their indictment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Megaupload's Indictment
1. In practice, the "vast majority" of users do not have any significant long term private storage capability. Continued storage is dependent upon regular downloads of the file occurring. Files not downloaded are rapidly removed in most cases, whereas popular downloaded files are retained.

2. Because a small proportion of users pay for storage, the business is dependent upon advertising. Adverts are primarily viewed when files are downloaded and the business model is therefore not based upon storage but upon maximizing downloads.

3. Persons indicted have "instructed individual users how to locate links to infringing content on the Mega Sites ... [and] ... have also shared with each other comments from Mega Site users demonstrating that they have used or are attempting to use the Mega Sites to get infringing copies of copyrighted content."

4. Persons indicted, unlike the public, are not reliant upon links to stored files, but can search the internal database directly. It is claimed they have "searched the internal database for their associates and themselves so that they may directly access copyright-infringing content".

5. A comprehensive takedown method is in use to identify child pornography, but not deployed to remove infringing content. (item 24)

6. Infringing users did not have their accounts terminated, and the defendants "made no significant effort to identify users who were using the Mega Sites or services to infringe copyrights, to prevent the uploading of infringing copies of copyrighted materials, or to identify infringing copies of copyrighted works" (item 55-56)

7. An incentivizing program was adopted encouraging the upload of "popular" files in return for
payments to successful uploaders. (item 69e et al)

8. Defendants explicitly discussed evasion and infringement issues (69i-l)
__________________
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