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Rating:  

8.2

View Poll Results: LSC - How'd We Do?
5 - Outstanding. I'm amazed that you all pulled this off! 29 35.80%
4 - It was pretty good but some things need some major attention. 34 41.98%
3 - So so. Little good and little bad. 10 12.35%
2 - Overall needs major improvement. Some parts were ok. 4 4.94%
1 - Sucks. Worst tournament I've ever seen. 4 4.94%
Voters: 81. You may not vote on this poll

 
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02-22-2009   3 links from elsewhere to this Post. Click to view. #1 (permalink)
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Question LSC: QCGC and How'd We Do?

QCGC - Questions, Comments, Gripes, Complaints.

Now that it's all over we'd like to know how everyone thinks we did. Please feel free to provide comments on what you liked, what you disliked, what we did well, and what you think we could do better on. This kind of feedback will help us take a great tournament into a legendary tournament. The poll is just for an overall "how'd we do" - we'd like to get more granular reporting here.

One word of caution: None of us respond well to "BAW BAW U SUCK QQ". If you're going to complain about something, try to help us out with a suggestion. If you do decide to just QQ cry that's fine but expect that we'll likely ignore your complaint.
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02-22-2009   #2 (permalink)
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I voted 4:

Suggestions:

1. Set Effects enabled. I know some pvpers were farming and spent tons of gold for the eternal flame set, but useless in the tournament. Also, set effects boosts different classes by different amounts.

2. Deviation between Forest and City. Gives more choice to the pvpers. People have different playstyles.

3. Keep it in Balanced. Though its in Free Mode in Klunia, the upcoming patch for balanced will make it more fair.

4. Body Trap. Depending on if it is banned in Klunia. <- Need clarification

5. Lift the limit on windmill and input a limit like no more than two windmills at wall. Windmill is mostly for show and the user risks him/herself when using it. <-- This isn't really needed, but I doubt it will hurt the future tournament.
 
02-22-2009   #3 (permalink)
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The organization and flow of the tournament went extremely well. It was very outstanding work on you guys' part.

- I think a major issue was body blocking and transformation potions, i believe that both should be banned, for the simple interest of fairness, (I think that yukis and tia's were at a major disadvantage because of this, since they really can't do anything against it)

- People that are disruptive should be kicked on the spot after the round, it's really annoying having to look at people whine and complain about something they're doing in the match, especially when the ref's are trying to do their job.

I'll add more as i think of them.
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02-22-2009   #4 (permalink)
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Hey guys - thanks for the good suggestions. We'd like to hear more -keep them coming =]

Posted from my iPhone.
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02-22-2009   #5 (permalink)
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that was way better organized than the TFT one lol
people actually KNOW about this tourney lol
5/5
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02-22-2009   #6 (permalink)
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No one-combo kills rule. Rules are placed to make it fair for each side. If one side completely dominates for most of the match, they should deserve to win, not get instantly KO'd by a single slip-up.

That also means set effects should remain off. I know every Yuki in the world does NOT want to see people running full Kanhel and getting full ice invincibility every xx seconds. Also because people who farmed for those amazing amounts of INT equips should keep them instead of just running 4x L.Drake, and because +50% AEH bonus is just overpowered.

On the whole, I'd rate the tournament a relative 4/5 for the amount of effort and organization put into this.
 
02-22-2009   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaiety
No one-combo kills rule. Rules are placed to make it fair for each side. If one side completely dominates for most of the match, they should deserve to win, not get instantly KO'd by a single slip-up.

That also means set effects should remain off. I know every Yuki in the world does NOT want to see people running full Kanhel and getting full ice invincibility every xx seconds. Also because people who farmed for those amazing amounts of INT equips should keep them instead of just running 4x L.Drake, and because +50% AEH bonus is just overpowered.

On the whole, I'd rate the tournament a relative 4/5 for the amount of effort and organization put into this.
i disagree with the first suggestion, i dont see why there should be a penalty for someone that has the skill to do a potentially deadly combo that's within all the rules, and it's not like it's any sort of infinite, or the person cant mess up at all. isnt that what pvp is all about? making the best of your skill? (within rules). i start up a freeze nuke combo, i slip up halfway, i deserve to get hit with their most damage dealing combo they have...

the second suggestion, i agree with fully.
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02-22-2009   #8 (permalink)
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The first one. No thanks. With the upcoming patches, AOEs will be more devastating. Meaning it can wear the opponent down to zero health before the opponent catches him/her.

The second one. Well, Like I said in my first post. Set effects work differently depending on your class. But Its a type of gameplay and a type of style. I don't care if set effect is on or not though.

Edit:

Dont care about second suggestion
But the first one should definately not be implanted.

Last edited by Eternal; 02-22-2009 at 04:27 PM.
 
02-22-2009   #9 (permalink)
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well, I'm kinda torn about the first rule (don't kill in one combo)

people keep saying that it's really hard for tia to even get a hit in (maybe they're wrong?), and Seraph kept Shadow out so much, why isn't it fair for Shadow to take him out in one shot? but like you said, if you mess up just once, there goes your life...

maybe it should not apply to tia?

I definitely agree with the second suggestion
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02-22-2009   #10 (permalink)
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5/5, a lot of tourneys dont get this much effort put in...good job!
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02-22-2009   #11 (permalink)
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i'll reply with my suggestions when i go back to apt.. i have it typed up since u started running although it's not complete
one thing though
3/4 place match is only 2/3 it's not important to have 3/5 for people who aren't going to win anyways
3/4 place match has as much importance as the semi finals maybe less (doesn't matter if it's title matches, it's how i see almost all tournaments do)

Good job hosting ur first tourney though. many ways u can ease ur work and such.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eternal
I voted 4:

Suggestions:

1. Set Effects enabled. I know some pvpers were farming and spent tons of gold for the eternal flame set, but useless in the tournament. Also, set effects boosts different classes by different amounts.
set effects should be optional because of the immunities which are quite annoying, or there can be a rule stating all immunities or skill removal set effects cannot be used
2. Deviation between Forest and City. Gives more choice to the pvpers. People have different playstyles.
this doesn't really matter but as KL does it. they do it every other tourney
3. Keep it in Balanced. Though its in Free Mode in Klunia, the upcoming patch for balanced will make it more fair.
yea... that.
4. Body Trap. Depending on if it is banned in Klunia. <- Need clarification
from what i saw on KL tournies.. body traps that are unescapable are illegal such as invinci framed ones
the one used by sieg is escapable in all ways except a simple dash

5. Lift the limit on windmill and input a limit like no more than two windmills at wall. Windmill is mostly for show and the user risks him/herself when using it. <-- This isn't really needed, but I doubt it will hurt the future tournament.
windmill's limit is actually higher on this tourney than KL.
KL's rules only state one thing.. no more than 2 it's a general rule that applies to everything but
from the vids no sieg does more than 180 because any more is a repetition of a 90degrees shift which is useless besides stalling
they also do not do more than 2 frontals but that's already in the rules
if anyone remembers rules from my tourney which i used to experiment on rules
i stated 5 hit windmill because that's a 180 windmill if u add a frontal that'll be 6 hits anymore breaks the rules of frontal and 180
ah... one i noticed after watching the finals and stuff
disable chat on ur side.. u will be distracted and does not allow u to pay attention to the match. this is very unprofessional

lower the amount of participants by half at least down to 32 if u want it within a month(add single elimination with seeding if u must for qualification)
rushing the last few rounds isn't really good... KL tournies last UP TO 3 months but anyways i wouldn't want that either

Last edited by Lunar; 02-22-2009 at 05:21 PM.
 
02-22-2009   #12 (permalink)
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4/5'd for some of the rules.
Some people like RPG have an amazing ability to combo, and they should be able to use that in tournaments. Capping combos to a certain number of skills doesn't allow for that. It seems like the TFT tourny's rules would work better for this (no more than 2x consecutive strings). This would prevent "cheap" infinites and still allow people to do long combos.
Combos should only count as a series of attack that are inescapable without skills. That way something like a ground AA hd AA hd AA would be legal (since it's entirely escapable) while Tia's slide AA slide AA slide AA would be illegal (can only escape using a skill with invincibility frames).
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no spectators (you're gunna put vids up anyway) cause friends can whisp about magic defense, light shield, healing off screen, etc
also, i have mixed feelings about balanced. compare a 66-69 seig's nado+dfist to a 7x's nado+dfist
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Last edited by rainbows; 02-22-2009 at 05:32 PM.
 
02-22-2009   #14 (permalink)
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... DQing Jeneral because he used an emote, while not even penalizing JinUS for breaking the windmill limit about 5+ times... Yeah, major problems.

Also, same feelings about balanced. 59s and 29s should be auto banned, or it should be in free lol.
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Last edited by Jumper; 02-22-2009 at 05:51 PM.
 
02-22-2009   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jumper
... DQing Jeneral because he used an emote, while not even penalizing JinUS for breaking the windmill limit about 5+ times... Yeah, major problems.

Also. same feelings about balanced. 59s and 29s should be auto banned, or it should be in free lol.
mmmm... yeah

it's weird, it's like you have to pick a magical level to stay at to get bonuses in balanced...
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02-22-2009   #16 (permalink)
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4/5, good job. I agree with Lunar about having less players and seeding. For player selection maybe have team battle qualifications rather than just posting; 128 players was too excessive.
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02-22-2009   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by incarnate
4/5, good job. I agree with Lunar about having less players and seeding. For player selection maybe have team battle qualifications rather than just posting; 128 players was too excessive.
it was done pretty well for 128 people tho

only thing i really hated was the spec limit except IJJI cant do anything about that
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02-22-2009   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jumper
... DQing Jeneral because he used an emote, while not even penalizing JinUS for breaking the windmill limit about 5+ times... Yeah, major problems.

Also, same feelings about balanced. 59s and 29s should be auto banned, or it should be in free lol.
a lvl 69's ih does the same as a lvl 66. Same with Dfist. <-- Tested. I have noticed no difference between 68 to 69
Should a lvl 66 Sieg be banned as well?

I just hope the balanced patch comes before the next tourny.
 
02-22-2009   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jumper
... DQing Jeneral because he used an emote, while not even penalizing JinUS for breaking the windmill limit about 5+ times... Yeah, major problems.

Also, same feelings about balanced. 59s and 29s should be auto banned, or it should be in free lol.
Can you give an example for when JinUS broke the windmill rule? I saw one of this matches (first one against CrunchyRoll in round 1) and the windmills he did were all legal.
Which brings me to one of the problems... the rules have to be a bit more clear. For example, the windmill rule can be interpreted in different ways. I thought a 180 windmill in the air was illegal (had to do 45 degree then shift, then another for a max of 360) when it is actually legal.
It's better to have multi rules instead of having just 1, with a bunch crammed together. So in this case, its better to have:
- Cannot frontal more than twice in a row
- Cannot windmill for more than a total of 360 degrees in 1 combo.

I'd give the tourny 4/5 for good organization and a great job presenting/holding the tourny in game.
 
02-22-2009   #20 (permalink)
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Spoiler!


The problem with set effects is that some are overpowered compared to others.

There's L Rotem: Whenever you take damage from your opponent, at a certain %, you can't get hit by physical attacks for a few seconds.

L Drake: 7.5% MP Regeneration. Unlimited MP in balance.

Eternal Flame: Dragon flute at 50% chance after using level 60 skill.

Myth 1: +50% damage for all attacks.

PvP Equips: Opponent can't use skills for a certain amount of time, Reversed controls.

A number of these have effects that just make them overpowered, and people that rely on set effects won't be able to advance. You have to be able to PvP with your own skill, not rely on some set bonus that OHKO's the opponent or makes you OHKO them in seconds.

EDIT:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bredgen
Which brings me to one of the problems... the rules have to be a bit more clear. For example, the windmill rule can be interpreted in different ways. I thought a 180 windmill in the air was illegal (had to do 45 degree then shift, then another for a max of 360) when it is actually legal.
It's better to have multi rules instead of having just 1, with a bunch crammed together. So in this case, its better to have:
- Cannot frontal more than twice in a row
- Cannot windmill for more than a total of 360 degrees in 1 combo.
I thought the rules were already set out like that.
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Last edited by Gladiat; 02-22-2009 at 06:36 PM.
 

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