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imported_john 06-06-2009 01:22 AM

John's Krieg Skill Analysis/Build Guide
 
This guide is designed to help Kriegs plan their build according to what they want. A sticky would be appreciated :D

Skill Analysis

Power

Repulse
A skill with a slow start and pushes monsters (if you can) for a bit. The last hit knocks them down. A good skill for Myth and overall mob control.
Suggested: 0, 1

Physical Strength
Your main skill that increase air. Actually, the second hit does all the air increasing lol. The more points you invest in this skill means that the enemy will go higher. Level 4 is the minimum required for pvp kriegs.
Notes: 7 is the minumum level required to do a physical strength into 100 ton fire comet combo with no decay.
Suggested: 0, 4, 7, 11

Force
The first two hits are normal hits, the last one stuns. Not much to say here lol.
Suggested: 0, 1

Super Strength
A skill where Krieg jumps forward and launches everything around him to the air.
Suggested: 11

Divine Force
One of the most versatile skills in Lunia. Pressing space three times while using this skill will enable you to combo more. The third and fourth hits are resetters.
Suggested: 0, 1, 11

Tactical

Disturbance
Krieg jumps in the air and knocks down/confuses enemies around him in a big circle. Big invincible frame and open for a very long time.
The more points you pump in here, the longer confuse will last.
Suggested: 0, 1

1000 Ton Pendulum
This skill has four hits. The first and second hits are the most used in combos, as the third hit knocks enemies down and the fourth hit usually gets canceled.
The first hit can pick up enemies from the groud. All in all, one of the best moves for comboing.
Suggested: 0, 1

Revival
Krieg uses some HP to cast a small HP platform in front of him. The hammer can hit enemies when he casts the platform. The more people stand on the platform, the more heals are received.
To fakeres with this skill, one must cast it on the dead player and quickly run over the platform.
Suggested: 0, 1, 11

Party HP recovery
It costs hp to use this skill. Krieg's "sunlight of healing" It has a very big range of 100 and it can heal a little past the edge of the circle that you see on the animation.
Maxing this would be pointless since level 1 is enough for a good fakeres (it heals 200 at level 1 lol)
Suggested: 0, 1

Adamantine F. Bolt
Krieg launched a "firebolt" in front of him. Dash cancel after so you don't get stuck in the silly animation. It launches in a straight line and can stun.
The more points you put in here, the farther the firebolt goes. Basically, max this if you're really good at sniping at pvp. If staging, keep this 0.
Suggested: 0, 1, 10

Fire Crush
Krieg jumps up and crushed the ground underneath. It slows enemies, and deals decent damage. Invincible frame while in the air and you're only open for a split second.
Dash or skill cancel after you hit the ground to get out of that lame animation lol.
Suggested: 11

Hammer Scratch
Homing projectile that blinds. Not much to say. Using this in combos will gain height. Personally I prefer to just use it for first hit enabler in pvp. In stage, kinda useless.
Don't max since the range from 8 to 10 doesn't increase, and damage increase is minimal.
Suggested: 0, 8

New Fire Crush
Like the original, except you go a little farther and launch the enemies really high in the air. Gets in the way of teamwork sometimes, but can really save someone's butt and buy them time to run if they're getting mobbed.
The damage to sp ratio isn't as good as regular fire crush, but it's okay damage. Lvl 1 just for the invinc and launch effects.
Suggested: 0, 1, 11

True Revival
Godly heal, enough said. Like Revival, the more people that stand on it the more heals you get. The HP Platform is bigger and you don't need HP to cast it. Fakeressing is easy, all you have to do is cast it.
Leveling this up will give you more HP, however, no one has THAT much hp anyway. Since the amount of heals you get depends on how many people stand on the platform, theoretically level 1 should be enough
to full heal your whole party. But max it if you want more heals.
Suggested: 0, 1, 5

Will

Hammer Blast
Krieg runs forward and hits/pushes back. Can be used to dodge things. Good damager. If you use against the wall you can increase your height by cancelling the last hit by shifting.
Suggested: 0, 1, 11

Violent Whirlwind
First hit launches up, the rest just makes the enemy go with Krieg. If you miss the first hit you can drag stuff along with you until the last hit, where they get knocked down.
Dash and skill cancellable. Can be used for epic mob control.
Suggested: 0, 1, 11

100 Ton Fire Comet
Krieg's "dfist," the range is actually bigger than the animation. Knocks back far, and good damage, short cd.
Suggested: 11

Hammer Boomerang
Krieg throws his two hammers, first right and left in a curved fashion. It drags along anything it hits with, and even if you get canceled after throwing it enemies can still get hit (Like Sieg's "Whirling Sword")
If you press space three times you can continue/start the combo.
Suggested: 1, 11

Vehement Transformation
Krieg transforms into a different version of him. Melee can only be used. Melee damage increased according to level, as well as the time it takes to xform. However when you're xformed once you hit 0 HP you turn into
a ghost automatically, instead of getting a chance to be fakeres'd. Lvl 1 should be enough to take advantage of Ancient Elf Hero's Two Piece Set Effect.
Suggested: 0, 1, 6

New Hammer Blast
Looks like regular Hammer Blast except a little hammer projectile that pushes back appears. Has the highest damage potential out of all Krieg's skills.
Suggested: 0, 11

New Vehement Transformation
Same as the first xform, except a little weaker in my opinion. Same notes as the first one. As you can tell I'm not a fan of xforming but if you like it....
Suggested: o, 11

Bless

Mana Recovery
Krieg stand still for a long time, exchanging some HP for MP. This skill takes WAY too long to cast and the benefit isn't even that good. Think Eir's Price of Sacrifice but longer and useless.
Suggested: 0

Party MP Recovery
Makes four MP platforms that shoot out. Costs HP to use. Good if you stage with Siegs, Tias, Dacys, Ariens, and Ryans a lot. However with the new +1000 MP pot, it makes this skill useless. But it's nice if you have the extra points since it no longer
costs reagents lol. It shoots from Krieg at weird angles. Maybe 10 degrees and 20 degrees, approximately.
Suggested: 0, 9

Minimize Party Dmg
Similar to Blessed Defense, this skill is also absolutely useless. Minimize the damage only applies to PvPers (it decreases damage from crit and reduces damage from buffs like Blessed Bravery IIRC) and even then it isn't worth it...
Suggested: 0

Party Magic Defense
Magic attacks won't hurt you or teammates around you if you cast this spell. Costs 1 Rope and 1 Pearl from levels 1-4 and it costs 2 ropes and 2 pearls from level 5.
Costs hp and a little time to cast.
Suggested: 0, 4, 8

Ability

Increase Health
At level 1, it gives you +100 hp. At level 8, it gives you +660 hp. Choose according to your needs.
Suggested: 1, 8

Deadly Blow
You can get crit on stuff sometimes. Maxing it is a waste of points.
Suggested: 1

Mana Increase
Not worth it to put points into. The first level gives you a whopping +50 mana.
Suggested: 0

MP Recovery
You get mp as time goes on. Level depends if you get the other MP recovery skills and how well you manage your mana.
suggested: 0, 8

Minimize the Damage
See "Minimize Party Dmg." 0 for stage 4 for pvp.
Suggested: 0, 4




Sample Builds
Note: Extra points from some of these builds indicate that you should put them into places that you prefer.
The builds listed below are by no means PERFECT FOR EVERYONE. It just depends on your playstyle. Mess around with the skills,
and see which ones you like!

Stage builds

Barely any xform, just smash!!
Lunia Skill Calculator(JP)
Basically what I did was max all his super damaging moves, one point in the heals, one point into the skills that help mob up enemies, and one into xform. Because of xform nerf, I find that the only time to ever use xform would be with AEH. Level 1 should be enough for the 15 seconds. I personally have level 2 because the extra 5 seconds to smash is nice. However the xform should no longer be maxed since the dmg that increases per level is minimal. The rest of the build should be up to you. Physical Strength needs a minimal of 4 if you want to by a hybrid krieg and have combo ability. 1000 ton pendulum only needs 1 to be able to combo with.
Note: 1 point into True Revival.

Full Support Krieg
Lunia Skill Calculator(JP)
In case Eirs ever go extinct, here's a build for you! No xforms this build because you can't heal while you're xformed lol.
Note: 1 point into True Revival.

HULK ANGRY!!
Lunia Skill Calculator(JP)
This one... xform a lot, use the rest of the sp for Party MP recovery or maxing another attack skill.

PvP builds

Pure PvP Build
Lunia Skill Calculator(JP)
9 extra sp to raise whatever you like. Party Mdef for yourself, Make Physical Strength Higher, etc.

Hybrid Build
Lunia Skill Calculator(JP)
Note: 1 in True Revival.

Any questions or comments, feel free to leave one here or contact me in-game.
ign: Sione

Skiegh 06-06-2009 09:55 AM

Quote:

7 is the minumum level required to do a physical strength into 100 ton fire comet combo with no decay.
Just pointing out that my PS is level 6 and I can combo into comet just fine.

Snapple 06-06-2009 02:33 PM

John said with no decay, never said it couldnt be comboed with.

Skiegh 06-06-2009 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snapple (Post 854833)
John said with no decay, never said it couldnt be comboed with.

Physical strength to 100 ton comet is a combo, however short. I am saying that I can do PS to comet at level 6. That would imply that level 6-- perhaps even 5 is the minimum for doing PS to comet.

Unless he is implying that he can hit with comet after only the first hit of PS but I don't think that is possible due to charge distance.

HeartStation 06-06-2009 10:47 PM

Don't you think party hp recovery should be maxed? Because at max it heals about 800+hp.

imported_john 06-07-2009 12:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skiegh (Post 854947)
Physical strength to 100 ton comet is a combo, however short. I am saying that I can do PS to comet at level 6. That would imply that level 6-- perhaps even 5 is the minimum for doing PS to comet.

Unless he is implying that he can hit with comet after only the first hit of PS but I don't think that is possible due to charge distance.

I have level 5 PS and I can do >>A A PS <<> comet

I'm saying that with level 7, you can hit comet for sure and it won't decay with PS <<> comet. Idk what you're getting so feisty about lol


Quote:

Originally Posted by HeartStation (Post 855091)
Don't you think party hp recovery should be maxed? Because at max it heals about 800+hp.

Because of party hp recovery's large range, it should be used mainly as a fake-res skill, since True Revival can take care of healing people to 100% HP anyway.

Mengjun 06-07-2009 03:01 AM

Plus, higher lv party HP recov costs more HP, meaning that you can fake res in fewer situations.

Kadeshi 06-07-2009 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by imported_john (Post 855189)
I have level 5 PS and I can do >>A A PS <<> comet

i have lvl4 and i can do that also, sure hit, but i really dont use it cuz of the decay, and i have better tricks for stage

Haxie 06-07-2009 02:57 PM

hmm .. guide is ok .. tho i wont comment builds

imported_john 06-08-2009 12:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Haxie (Post 855611)
hmm .. guide is ok .. tho i wont comment builds

gogo comment!! cmon everyone knows you're the pro stage krieg.... share :D

Cookies 06-22-2009 07:06 AM

o. For the full support build, you should at least put a point in the level 60 transform just to activate the AEH effect since it is skill cancel-able. You also can do the same thing when you feel like its too dangerous to transform, like in Myth/ohko boss fights.

Personally I maxed Hammer Scratch for my stage build, just to deal with those hard-to-approach bosses/tightly packed mobs.

CursedScar 06-22-2009 09:40 AM

You shouldn't downplay Vehement Transformation so much. Along with the xform Krieg's already large attack range gets even larger. It's great mob control and really good damage maxed with AEH on top. I do 3k per spin in Myth with less than 1.5k str.

Cookies 06-22-2009 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CursedScar (Post 871565)
You shouldn't downplay Vehement Transformation so much. Along with the xform Krieg's already large attack range gets even larger. It's great mob control and really good damage maxed with AEH on top. I do 3k per spin in Myth with less than 1.5k str.

In Myth, you're better off not using transformations if you want to dps anywhere outside boss imo, and only use the RB transform for mob control for its large range but low damage, and cancel level 60 for AEH.

Zinc210 06-22-2009 10:42 AM

I think maxing Party Healing isn't a bad deal if you are going full support (which I plan on doing when I RB my krieg again :O). From what I've seen from other kriegs, it heals around 800~900 (can't remember exactly) at max, which is pretty nice considering it's good range. It's numbers are more or less smack dab in between Eir's Sunlight and E-heal :D

Sure, you'd have to pull 10 points from another skill, but his skills are such low CD and high damage, I doubt it'd really matter much :py32:

Cookies 06-22-2009 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zinc210 (Post 871620)
I think maxing Party Healing isn't a bad deal if you are going full support (which I plan on doing when I RB my krieg again :O). From what I've seen from other kriegs, it heals around 800~900 (can't remember exactly) at max, which is pretty nice considering it's good range. It's numbers are more or less smack dab in between Eir's Sunlight and E-heal :D

Sure, you'd have to pull 10 points from another skill, but his skills are such low CD and high damage, I doubt it'd really matter much :py32:

It's not about the points, using it for normal healing will hinder its fake-res abilities. Similar to Eirs using Emergency Healing as a normal heal. (lol)


Also, I hate how people nowadays say "N>Krieg OR Eir". I mean seriously, it's just retarded how people think a DPS class can replace an Eir with just 2 fake-res skill and that RB skill that came with the patch(which I hate with a passion).

Lunar 06-22-2009 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cookies (Post 871633)
It's not about the points, using it for normal healing will hinder its fake-res abilities. Similar to Eirs using Emergency Healing as a normal heal. (lol)


Also, I hate how people nowadays say "N>Krieg OR Eir". I mean seriously, it's just retarded how people think a DPS class can replace an Eir with just 2 fake-res skill and that RB skill that came with the patch(which I hate with a passion). It just completely destroys the fun in full DPS parties.

because most of us dont really need heal... we just need the occasional fake res if required or for siegs to cast their rage explosion without killing themselves

Cookies 06-22-2009 11:33 AM

There are those people, I'm not pointing my fingers at them. I'm talking about those who actually thinks that Krieg can replace Eir, and those who plays differently when a Krieg is in the party.

Krieg was meant to be a fake-res only character before the stupid patch, and mainly concentrate on doing damage like the others, but after the patch? I feel the burden of having to watch HP bars like I did on Eir again, and to be honest it's not fun for me. I like attacking, fake-res'ing once in a while is okay, but actually healing? I'd just rather leave you, watching you slack off, dying, and thinking I'm not doing my 'job'(which was never meant to be).

note: this is only to 'those people'.

Zinc210 06-22-2009 12:53 PM

The way I see it, when you use an AoE heal to fake res, being able to substantially heal yourself and other members at one time while saving someone is a nice bonus. This the reason I opted to Max Sunlight on my Eir as opposed to leaving it at level 1.

There are some parties where I don't even have to touch Light of Healing often and rarely use beads, because we are collectively good enough to survive off of my Sunlights I let loose every 12 seconds. The same idea more or less applies to Krieg. So yeah, he can replace an Eir in keeping the party topped off, but he can't handle the same amount of pressure an Eir can because he lacks the number of heals Eir possesses.

Cookies 06-22-2009 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zinc210 (Post 871854)
The way I see it, when you use an AoE heal to fake res, being able to substantially heal yourself and other members at one time while saving someone is a nice bonus. This the reason I opted to Max Sunlight on my Eir as opposed to leaving it at level 1.

There are some parties where I don't even have to touch Light of Healing often and rarely use beads, because we are collectively good enough to survive off of my Sunlights I let loose every 12 seconds. The same idea more or less applies to Krieg. So yeah, he can replace an Eir in keeping the party topped off, but he can't handle the same amount of pressure an Eir can because he lacks the number of heals Eir possesses.

.........

I hope you know that Krieg's heals all have 30 seconds of cooldown.

And you just proved my point, Krieg's cannot handle pressure like Eir's can, therefore they can't be replacements. Yet there are people that are still treating him like he is.

Zinc210 06-22-2009 01:12 PM

Yes, I was pretty much proving your point.

The only thing different i was saying was that in self sufficient parties, he can more or less take Eir's role: keeping your team topped off and fake ressing every so often (not the role of Goddess-of-Life-that-whom-without-we-shall-surely-fail)

Yes I am aware of his cooldowns, I have a Krieg :o. But in competent parties (which are rare) that cooldown isn't that bad after Dex is calculated. Especially when you look at how the cooldowns for healing next to nothing were 90 seconds pre-patch.


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