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04-08-2011   #1 (permalink)
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Games I've played:

MapleStory (Started it in 2004, was a beta tester, just tired of it)
Ragnarok Online (Refuse to play privates any more, and Gravity sucks at maintaining it)
Lunia (Was never really my type of MMORPG)
Final Fantasy XI (No money to pay for it)
La Tale (Sick of the unbalanced cash shop and autoloot being essential. A +15% cape to all stats and now a +10% mask to all stats that even stacks with the cape? Bull crap)
Wonder King (Once you transcend from Maple to La Tale, trying WK afterwards and enjoying it just doesn't work)
Lost Saga (I enjoyed Lost Saga which had some RPG elements but then once I realized just how unbalanced it was and there was just really no point in trying to play without forcing your self to be unbalanced, I quit, and I made it to 1LT with a skill level of 2LT Class 5 before you think about calling me a noob, I didn't use Mafia at all and only used Iron Knight, Grand Templar, Robin Hood and Muskateer. All of which were 20-30+, and I only used their default gears/their epic gears without using gears from any other jobs and I didn't do combo swaps, on purpose, because I like to be balanced and not play cheaply/dishonorly. You try winning consistently like that, especially in faction battles. Which I was able to sometimes, but not consistently because it's 100% impossible to. But I'm just that good.)
Lord of the Rings Online (It's cash shop is bullcrap but really it's overall western developed atmosphere and comic graphics just immediate turn off for me)
League of Legends (lol. People went on and on about how balanced and great it was but, it's more of an RTS, not an RPG, and just like LotRO, it's western developed atmosphere and comic graphics are a turn off. My graphics card hates it anyway, forces me to play in fullscreen, and the tutorial was really stupid and doesn't even work. Didn't bother trying any more, for I was never interested enough to begin with)

Any suggestions? I don't have the money for P2P games ATM, and I prefer your "standard/typical" MMOs which don't seem to be so standard or typical any more considering they're so rare. I don't really like RTS games that much, would prefer an MMORPG but I might be willing to check out some MMOs if they're good enough. I prefer eastern developed games, games that have the same comic graphics as WoW are an immediate turn off. I love sprites way more, but FFXI's graphics were fine to me too. Doesn't have to be sprites based of course.

I'm not interested in: Runes of Magic, Iris Online, Trickster, Rumble Fighter, Grand Chase, Dragonica, Dungeon Fighter, Legend of Edda, Mabinogi, Wind Slayer, Cabal, Atlantica, Luna, FlyFF, Last Chaos or Valkyrie Sky. Don't really care for FPS games, either.

I know, I'm picky. And yes I used that "Find a new game to play" feature which is awesome, but I wanna' ask too. That Metal Assault game looks amazingly fun but it's closed beta ATM, Elsword looks meh but I'll probably try it if we ever get it, and Dragon Nest looks like a lot of fun but doesn't come out until this summer.
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04-08-2011   #2 (permalink)
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Since you like LoZ so much try Spiral Knights. Its play style is a lot like zelda.
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04-08-2011   #3 (permalink)
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(dungeon focused games)

Elsword (PvP is just flat out bad. it will eventually get better but 90% of your time will be dungeoning till you cap. even after that theres rare hunting and elstones to gather for enchanting.)

Atlantica (maybe? i never got into PvP on this. was boring for me because its was excessively repetitive later game with alot of people using the same strategy and formations.)

that all i got for dungeons games . you tryed everything else i would've though of already.

(PvP focused games)

EVE (best PvP game iv ever played. although it is P2P after a while you may be able to try and buy time off the market. pretty expensive though, also there is a free trial encase you want to try it first.)

Cosmic Break (a shooter....kinda. some of the gacha bots are OP but that doesnt mean you cant do well with a UC (ingame currency) bot. overall fun game once you get used to the controls and tactics for staying alive.)

Grand Chase (lowest of the PvP games i recommend, only because i played it for quite a long time. game is pretty PvP centered but that doesn't mean dungeons cant be fun to. thing is there's only like 3 actually challenging dungeons in the game and they are all pretty much later game. (the 2 hero dungeons and Temple of Ascension.) anyways PvP is full of whiny kids but if you can get past that and find a good crew to play with it can be fun.)
 
04-08-2011   #4 (permalink)
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Thanks for the replies, guys!

I haven't ever heard of Spiral Knights before and they say it was just released on April 4th. So I looked into it and you're right, it's a lot like Zelda: Four Swords online with some RPG elements. It is a lot of fun! But since you can only
do so much in one day (you have 100 energy that refills every day, and you use energy to do stuff like entering dungeons, and once you run out, gotta' wait until the next day or buy some with real cash) I'll probably keep an eye out for other games as well. It's pretty fun, though!

I think I'll eventually try out Atlantica but it seems more strategy based for my tastes, which is why I've never really been interested in it. Cosmic Break, never heard of it. I'll check it out!

I've always been skeptical about Grand Chase but I guess I'll give it a try. I don't mind whiny kids in PvP, I mind unbalanced cash shops and unbalanced characters. If I lose, I want it to be completely because of skill, not because I don't pay to win or my gear wasn't as good as theirs or I was using the wrong character. I think the character Ronin? He seemed like the one I'd probably play as.

Elsword's PvP is broken? It looked okay from some videos I watched, I'd probably make a Rune Slayer or Lord Knight but I dunno', I think I'd get pretty bored of it after awhile, since you spend the majority of your time comboing or getting comboed, not actually fighting.

Again, thanks a ton for the replies!

I love me some dungeon/PvM/PvE games and I love me some PvP games. Either way is completely fine with me. :3
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04-08-2011   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SOC
Thanks for the replies, guys!

I haven't ever heard of Spiral Knights before and they say it was just released on April 4th. So I looked into it and you're right, it's a lot like Zelda: Four Swords online with some RPG elements. It is a lot of fun! But since you can only
do so much in one day (you have 100 energy that refills every day, and you use energy to do stuff like entering dungeons, and once you run out, gotta' wait until the next day or buy some with real cash) I'll probably keep an eye out for other games as well. It's pretty fun, though!

I think I'll eventually try out Atlantica but it seems more strategy based for my tastes, which is why I've never really been interested in it. Cosmic Break, never heard of it. I'll check it out!

I've always been skeptical about Grand Chase but I guess I'll give it a try. I don't mind whiny kids in PvP, I mind unbalanced cash shops and unbalanced characters. If I lose, I want it to be completely because of skill, not because I don't pay to win or my gear wasn't as good as theirs or I was using the wrong character. I think the character Ronin? He seemed like the one I'd probably play as.

Elsword's PvP is broken? It looked okay from some videos I watched, I'd probably make a Rune Slayer or Lord Knight but I dunno', I think I'd get pretty bored of it after awhile, since you spend the majority of your time comboing or getting comboed, not actually fighting.

Again, thanks a ton for the replies!

I love me some dungeon/PvM/PvE games and I love me some PvP games. Either way is completely fine with me. :3
i said it was bad, not broken. damage wise in CBT it was HORRIBLE. games toke forever because no one would die if they knew what they were doing because of the MASSIVE hp everyone got.

also, grand chase might not be the game for you then. OHKOs run rampt everywhere. also i believe you mean ronan? not the best char choice seeing as how badly they nerfed DK but his other jobs are still good. if you do deside to play if you dont like cash shop people i suggest stat and property restricted rooms. (stats are graded by letter. most people who do stat grade matches put the limit at C+) (property is mostly crit. you DO NOT want to pvp with someone that has high crit.)
 
04-08-2011   #6 (permalink)
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As an added comment to the CosmicBreak suggestion, if you find yourself to like it for its PvE elements more than its PvP elements, its predecessor and more quest-based version called C21 recently went into CBT. That is only to say if you enjoyed it.
Which I doubt. It has "comic graphics."

Grand Chase and Elsword PvP is horribly unbalanced from what I hear.
Grand Chase more so, simply because it's Ntreev SG. Last time I played, two people of the same character, class, and level could have one in latest in-game armor and one in latest cash shop armor, the cash shop was almost quadruple the stats. Cash shop also makes your life easy. Like "comparing Bill Gates plus the President of the United States to a bunch of minorities in the ghetto" easy. Just that much easier is your life with cash. Heard that the new characters are more overpowered than the heat of the sun to a refrigerator.
Elsword just looks lag-dependent and lenient to certain characters. Ask someone else though, I just heard this through the grapevine.
Both are "comic graphics."

If Dragon Nest interested you, try Vindictus. Third-person MMO hack and slash. People complain about some characters being "underpowered" (there's not even PvP [actually, there is "duel," but literally no one ever does it]), but it's within reasons. New patch coming soon is going to fix one of the proclaimed "underpowered" characters (staff-wielding Evie), which everyone seems pleased with (amazingly enough). Considering its current track record, it has a lot of promise in the long run, though you may go on downtime once you hit cap and end-game (not anytime soon with its current level 70 cap and episode... 6? Korea episode 9?)
Realistic graphics, unrealistic physics (play golf with carcasses!)

To further turn your interest away, if anyone ever tells you PvP in Dungeon Fighter Online is balanced, say no. At the very least, cash shop does not suck more than the residents of a red light district.
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Last edited by Nihil679; 04-08-2011 at 05:22 PM.
 
04-08-2011   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nihil679
As an added comment to the CosmicBreak suggestion, if you find yourself to like it for its PvE elements more than its PvP elements, its predecessor and more quest-based version called C21 recently went into CBT. That is only to say if you enjoyed it.
Which I doubt. It has "comic graphics."

Grand Chase and Elsword PvP is horribly unbalanced from what I hear.
Grand Chase more so, simply because it's Ntreev SG. Last time I played, two people of the same character, class, and level could have one in latest in-game armor and one in latest cash shop armor, the cash shop was almost quadruple the stats. Cash shop also makes your life easy. Like "comparing Bill Gates plus the President of the United States to a bunch of minorities in the ghetto" easy. Just that much easier is your life with cash. Heard that the new characters are more overpowered than the heat of the sun to a refrigerator.
Elsword just looks lag-dependent and lenient to certain characters. Ask someone else though, I just heard this through the grapevine.
Both are "comic graphics."

If Dragon Nest interested you, try Vindictus. Third-person MMO hack and slash. People complain about some characters being "underpowered" (there's not even PvP [actually, there is "duel," but literally no one ever does it]), but it's within reasons. New patch coming soon is going to fix one of the proclaimed "underpowered" characters (staff-wielding Evie), which everyone seems pleased with (amazingly enough). Considering its current track record, it has a lot of promise in the long run, though you may go on downtime once you hit cap and end-game (not anytime soon with its current level 70 cap and episode... 6? Korea episode 9?)
Realistic graphics, unrealistic physics (play golf with carcasses!)

To further turn your interest away, if anyone ever tells you PvP in Dungeon Fighter Online is balanced, say no. At the very least, cash shop does not suck more than the residents of a red light district.
elsword isn't so bad. its just some classes are easier to combo with and can combo longer then others. (elsword and his kick for instance. can make so wicked combos.) everyone that isn't elsword/raven/eve have that whole ranged advantage thing going on. especially rena with her siege mode t_t

they fixed GCs stats by makeing them all but useless except in absurd quantity. now its pretty much just crit but anyone can get that depending on wether or not there willing to farm archimedia (the highest level Continent atm) alone on champion which is a real pain to do OR spending weeks doing hero just for one card. i think ill take archimedia dungeons anyday.
 
04-08-2011   #8 (permalink)
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I guess I should explain a bit more about what I feel is "comic graphics." I feel like WoW, LotRO, LoL, and Runes of Magic are "comic graphics." I feel like MapleStory, Ragnarok Online, La Tale, Wonder King and even FFXI to an extent are "anime graphics." I like anime graphics way more than I like comic graphics. The "comic graphics" have this western feel to them that I simply can't feel immersed in or enjoy, but the "anime graphics" have the eastern feel that I absolutely love and adore. Mind you I don't mean like medieval fantasy vs oriental samurai stuff, I just mean the certain feel of the graphics. I love medieval fantasy the most (castles, dragons, knights, mmm <3) and stuff like that, which I guess is another reason why I was so interested in those MMOs to begin with.

But these feel like comics to me:





^
Get this, those are three different games. WoW, LotRO and Runes of Magic. You can't even tell, can you?

While these feel like anime to me:







Ironically, I can't take the "comic graphics" seriously but I can take the "anime graphics" seriously just fine, lol. Not saying I enjoy "cutesy monsters" and stuff, but I enjoy the serious ones enough to enjoy the overall game and PvP. I feel like Grand Chase and Elsword are "anime" based enough, even though they're essentially based off of manga right? o_o I guess the point is, you can simply tell when a game was western developed and when it was eastern developed. I feel like Korea/Japan does a better job at making western styled games than NA/Europe does, lol.

I looked into CosmicBreak, it seems anime enough. Maybe a bit chibi but definitely far from what I feel is "comic."

I might try Vindictus but, I can already tell I'd get super bored of it very fast. It sort of reminds me of Lunia, and I dunno', I feel like it's repetition would just kill me and I'd get tired of it after a few hours. Kind've like how I got tired of Maple and La Tale's skill spamming, which is why I prefer a Blader/the sub jobs in LT the most. Lots of attacks, few skills. RO and FFXI is like Blader/sub jobs in LT, too, and that's the way I love it. <3 Lost Saga was like that, too.

Well Nexon and "balanced" simply don't mix very well, but I'm still willing to give Vindictus a try. Dungeon Fighter... I dunno'. I love Streets of Rage and those kinds of arcade beat 'em ups but I don't see my self playing an MMO like it for very long.
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04-08-2011   #9 (permalink)
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here are some GGFTW first 10 vids (except cosmic break) to show how GC, elsword, and cosmic break are.

Grand Chase - ggFTW First 10 - MMORPG Videos - ggFTW

Elsword - ggFTW First 10 - MMORPG Videos - ggFTW

V- cosmic break PvE. if you want to see PvP you should checkout some of nihils videos or something.

YouTube - Cosmic Break GamePlay
 
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Gameplay, depending on character, mostly involves clicks and more clicks, guard or dodge an attack, run up, repeat, wait for stamina, repeat. "Skills" are simply different combinations of clicks (save staff Evie). Game varies greatly in difficulty.
If the gameplay of Vindictus is not immerse enough to grasp you, the story might, at the very least, pique an interest like literature.

Nexon fixed its shit long ago. To say Nexon is still horrible and garbage is to have standards up too high.
DevCat, developers of Vindictus, had only recently gave Vindictus the staff Evie patch. With the push of an array of complainers, Nexon delivered this patch earlier than it should have been. Do note that Nexon had stated long before that they were supposed to stay two months behind with the Korea version. At most, the staff Evie patch may have been less than a month released.
Dungeon Fighter Online's developer, Neople, is to blame for any "unbalance" in the game. Having watched so many Korean Dungeon and Fighter tournament videos, I am almost jaded because I can very closely guess the outcome of the battle simply by the class set-up each team uses. Furthermore, there has been few attempts to fix characters, and the few attempts that do happen, either do nothing or create a new rift in power. I've heard of even the Koreans complaining of the end-game, as the game progresses and levels raise and equipments are better, certain classes become almost exponentially more powerful, while others lag behind. I almost dare say that Nexon's Dungeon Fighter Online is tame in comparison to the Korean Nexon Dungeon and Fighter, simply because of the lack of content.
Not to mention to badmouth Nexon is to badmouth the host of Dragon Nest, unless you are to play the global version. I highly doubt anything can go wrong.
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04-08-2011   #11 (permalink)
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What I blame Nexon for is their horrid greed in the cash shop. Considering I started Maple in 2004, that was when it was just Wizet and before Nexon even showed their face. Then all of a sudden Nexon comes, throws in the cash shop, and at first it's okay, purely for cosmetics, but then all of a sudden it goes out of control and the whole game is ruined because of it. Now you can sell/trade in game items for NX cash, and even buy in game currency directly with NX cash. That's bull crap. Yes, I know how fast Nexon is able to dish out content, but that's not enough to make me respect them. Content isn't good enough when it's ruined by a horrible cash shop.

For Dungeon Fighter, I can't speak for it. As I've never played it, I just assumed it had another crappy cash shop since Nexon was in charge. As for Vindictus, if it doesn't have one yet, it's only a matter of time. The same applies to Dragon's Nest. I know Nexon is in charge of it, but at least for a little while it'll be fun until the cash shop comes and screws it all up. That's why I'm so skeptical about things that Nexon run. But that's really how all free gaming companies are nowadays, greedy money *****s that think it's logical to make your game worse to make more money. But I guess the majority of NA players love paying to win, so it'll just have to stay that way until I make my own MMORPG. 8D

Anyway, it seemed like for Vindictus you get a lot of different combos/attacks at the beginning, but never really get anything new and end up doing the same attacks over and over and over and over and over again for the entire game and nothing ever changes other than monsters you fight. That gets old to me, very fast. :/
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Quote:
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What I blame Nexon for is their horrid greed in the cash shop. Considering I started Maple in 2004, that was when it was just Wizet and before Nexon even showed their face. Then all of a sudden Nexon comes, throws in the cash shop, and at first it's okay, purely for cosmetics, but then all of a sudden it goes out of control and the whole game is ruined because of it. Now you can sell/trade in game items for NX cash, and even buy in game currency directly with NX cash. That's bull crap. Yes, I know how fast Nexon is able to dish out content, but that's not enough to make me respect them. Content isn't good enough when it's ruined by a horrible cash shop.

For Dungeon Fighter, I can't speak for it. As I've never played it, I just assumed it had another crappy cash shop since Nexon was in charge. As for Vindictus, if it doesn't have one yet, it's only a matter of time. The same applies to Dragon's Nest. I know Nexon is in charge of it, but at least for a little while it'll be fun until the cash shop comes and screws it all up. That's why I'm so skeptical about things that Nexon run. But that's really how all free gaming companies are nowadays, greedy money *****s that think it's logical to make your game worse to make more money. But I guess the majority of NA players love paying to win, so it'll just have to stay that way until I make my own MMORPG. 8D

Anyway, it seemed like for Vindictus you get a lot of different combos/attacks at the beginning, but never really get anything new and end up doing the same attacks over and over and over and over and over again for the entire game and nothing ever changes other than monsters you fight. That gets old to me, very fast. :/
well your kinda right. what they use is a gacha system. i used to play dungeon fighter myself and you could buy cash cloths off other people (gos over your char sprite to make you look different. lots of set). thing is that these cloths can have + skills, attack speed, and other things on them which made the price just SKYROCKET depending on the amount it gives. the time it went downhill for me was when they added those cubes that fused useless avatars together to make a avatar with a skill of your choice.
 
04-08-2011   #13 (permalink)
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Yeah, that's called "functional fashion." It's bull crap. And even if all it did was cosmetic/aesthetics over your armor, the fact you can trade it for in game currency means the market in it would be all outta' whack. "Need in game money? Spend real money!" But I can live with that, I guess, just not the functional fashion "pay to win" garbage. It only gets worse from there.
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Dungeon Fighter Online is by far the most tame and balanced cash shop I've witnessed, save for Rare Avatars in PvP. The stat boosts are extremely balanced, a full set of Korean tournament-legal (no rare, no event) avatar only gives a boost of roughly 21% attack and cast speed, some variable amounts of +100 HP/MP (to your some five-six digit HP in PvP), 10% movespeed, and an odd +10 to all status (in comparison to thousands from end-game equipment alone). They help, but they are not required.
To rid of microtransactions is to rid of free games. Pure cosmetic cash shop only? Look where that got Fantasy Earth: Zero. The game closed, most likely not due to unpopularity, but most likely due to lack of cash shop sales. All equipment of cash shop were even after a few certain tuning, which can be done with in-game currency. It was too balanced.
Defunct market due to cash shop? Other than a shift in wealth and a new item to buy on the market, what is so defunct about this system? Is it not the same as real life economics? When you introduce a new item and it proves popular, it will be expensive as supplies will be low and everyone will want it. After time passes, supplies will begin to surplus and everyone will stop wanting up, thus prices lower. Is that not the same in all game economies? Vindictus is a perfect example, new armor in Vindictus reaches up to 600k and I've seen it hit over 1mil for a single piece of equipment because it is new. Similarly, as cash shop becomes a popular and abundant thing, prices are to stabilize and the market at rest until the next big item arrives. It is then that people need to spend more money on the new thing to sell, thus a general cycle is created that leaves the producers with a healthy profit to run their game, pay their employees, and frolic in their underwear as they rain money in their offices, as well as leave the general community at content.
For the free-users are the majority and create the popularity of the game, they want cash-shop.
The cash-users want it easier, thus they buy cash-shop and sell it to the free-users and provide the money source for the producer.
The producer is making profits, so they produce more for the free-users.
Quite frankly, Nexon has done an excellent job in their part. They do not stray from the game's origins to my knowledge.

Vindictus is violent Monster Hunter. Of course this shit gets repetitive, it's the repetition that everyone loves.
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04-08-2011   #15 (permalink)
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It's only a matter of time before Dungeon Fighter gets more and more "un-tame" cash shop items and it gets ruined beyond belief and playability in a real tournament setting. (And if they still allow said cash gear in tournaments, then they just don't care about balance and I think their tournaments are automatically invalid) Besides, if "they help" at all, then that's wrong in my eyes. Should be completely fair, balanced, even, 50:50 chance of winning if on equal skilled levels.

I really doubt Fantasy Earth: Zero "died" because it was "too balanced." I think it "died" because it wasn't popular enough, and just wasn't properly designed and didn't hit its target audience well enough and just a bunch of reasons.

In games that allow you to buy cash shop stuff from other players with in game money, it creates rifts in the player base. Those who have cash shop money have all the in game money and effectively control the game's market. The game's market ultimately inflates permanently, and steadily increasingly over time, as the cash shop buyers become the consumers and the non-cash shop buyers become the producers. Since the people with cash have a lot of in game money, the non-cash shop stuff (like normal equips, ect.) prices go up. This makes players who do not use cash suffer more and more over time. La Tale proves this, and just any game that allows for such things. (MapleStory and Ragnarok Online as well) Vind is a very very new game. It will get worse and worse as time goes on.

The majority of North American free players prefer "chaos and unbalance" in their games and pay-to-win. I don't disagree with that. I just don't care about them. I firmly believe you don't need to have an unbalanced cash shop to make "enough" money to sustain your game and employees comfortably. You just better make sure you're targeting the right audiences, doing things right and working very very hard. Which is exactly what I'm gonna' be doing. :3

Nexon has horribly strayed from Maple's origins. Dungeon Fighter and Vind are extremely new. Maple has been around since 2004. Give it time; they will get worse.

Anyway, this is going way off topic.

IMO Monster Hunter isn't very repetitive. There's just so much to do and so much content in it, so many weapons to try without any real commitment (other than resources to make them but even then it doesn't take THAT long to make a half decent bowgun even if you only main great swords, SNS, and lances or something) since there's no levels, no skill masteries or anything. Just pick up a weapon and start using it. With a ton of monsters and tons of strategies and party setups, it just doesn't get old. Vind is much different than MH IMO. I mean I can't speak for it too much as I haven't played it yet but...
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04-08-2011   #16 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dani
Since you like LoZ so much try Spiral Knights. Its play style is a lot like zelda.
tl;dr the thread

Sprial knights looks pretty fun i might try it
 
04-08-2011   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SOC
It's only a matter of time before Dungeon Fighter gets more and more "un-tame" cash shop items and it gets ruined beyond belief and playability in a real tournament setting.
You should still give it a shot.
 
04-08-2011   #18 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Veloze
You should still give it a shot.
Yeah I think I will someday. It's not Nexon that turns me away from it but just the overall game it self really isn't my style. But I wanna' be sure to expand my horizons considering I'm gonna' be making MMORPGs afterall.
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Your only option is to wait now for new games to release. You've already tried or are planning to try all the games that fit your bill. I place bets on Spiral Knights as well to be the most appealing game to you, so DO EET.

Quote:
The game's market ultimately inflates permanently, and steadily increasingly over time, as the cash shop buyers become the consumers and the non-cash shop buyers become the producers. Since the people with cash have a lot of in game money, the non-cash shop stuff (like normal equips, ect.) prices go up. This makes players who do not use cash suffer more and more over time.
Actually, DFO economy is just getting better and better as time passes by
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04-08-2011   #20 (permalink)
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Yeah I've played a ton of Spiral Knights today and used up all my energy already, which I think you seem to get 10 energy back every hour? So basically I gotta' wait until tomorrow to play more, haha.
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