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07-11-2012   #1 (permalink)
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Exclamation Few questions for Coons

Hey guys, I just got back to trickster after a 3 year break. Alot has changed and I've read on alot of threads and I want to make a Coon. I need help with choosing whether to go Pure AP/Pure HP/Pure AV/Hybrid. I also am looking to make a coon that will have good survivability and won't be too hard to use (will deal damage to enemies etc.). Do keep in mind that I don't have any funds.

Thanks!
 
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07-20-2012   #2 (permalink)
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well it depends on what coon you plan on using. If you're the Gambler type, i will suggest :

1144 pure HV with a balance of HV/HP EQs

the reason for this is so that you can do good damage with both your AoEs (Impelling Rage, Power Charging, and Full House). note that the recoil damage of Full House is based on your AP so its OK to have it not so high, yet with enough HP to survive those recoils. IR and PC are HP dependent and I wouldn't really invest on it much not until you hit 30k+ HP, or at least enough to OHKO the monsters you are killing. the only downside to this build is that because you have 1 in the power stat department, you will have significantly (almost nil) whacks to monsters, but you'll be relying on you're AoEs and skills for grinding.

i recommend also taking a look at Kyzuumi's Guide for Gamblers
/forum/charm-type-gu...ml#post1632872

what i personally prefer tho is to go for a hybrid Duke and get the skills of a 2nd job cat like Volley Kick, Siren Song, Sumo Suit. If you wanna know more about this, again, Kyzuumi's Diva guide can help. /forum/charm-type-gu...iva-guide.html
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07-20-2012   #3 (permalink)
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Gambler

If you're going for a PvP character you should go for Gambler (for wars, mostly), 1144 pure HP. It will allow you to take advantage of your gambler skills such as PC and IR and since you're 1144 you won't take a lot of damage from FH. With this build you should compound ALL of your equips with HP. You will also depend on your skills to grind.

If you want to be a Gambler and you don't want to PvP or you're more into PvM but still PvP from time to time I'd say go for 2134 Hybrid HP/HV, this will you make it easier for your OP and CS to deal damage, you will however lose more HP with FH. As a gambler you should always invest points into HP.


Duke

Duke is an okay character for PvP but it's only for 1 on 1 battles since it lacks strength in its AoE skills such as IR and Siren Song. If you're fighting a Magic type you're duke is pretty much useless, once you get rusted. You should go for 3124, either pure HV or Hybrid HP/HV, yes AP helps with your OP, CS and VK but so does HV and since HV also helps with evasion (as it stands for) in my opinion it is ALWAYS a better choice than going for AP.

If you're going for a PvM character it should be nearly the same thing, except I really do not recommend going for pure HV since you really don't need that much against mobs.


I've had both characters and I felt like Gambler was a really fun character to play with in PvP and outside of PvP but in the end of the day I like Duke better but that's just me. GL. :]
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07-20-2012   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
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Duke is an okay character for PvP but it's only for 1 on 1 battles since it lacks strength in its AoE skills such as IR and Siren Song. If you're fighting a Magic type you're duke is pretty much useless, once you get rusted.
I pretty much agree with what you've said except this part.

Dukes have Sumo Suit for damage reduction against a group of people and Deadly Funky to AoE Skunk. I was able to mass chain Skunk a group of people if I was paying attention against all those skills flying around in the past. It's deadly if done right.

Siren Song may be one of the weaker AoE skills but if built right, it can do enough damage. When I use to play, I was able to hit 12k ~ 15k in PVP. I wasn't pure HP nor did I have like 100k HP. At best, I had around 85k HP with 9~10k Defense, which was enough to hit that kind of damage. Obviously with all these new MyShop/Content, you'll need higher stats compared to before but it's still plausible.

Just because a Duke has a 3124 build does not make them useless against a Mage. There's a reason why your gears are HP/HV comped and that's to counter Rust (plus other reasons). One Pair and Volley Kick can be just as strong if you have the HV to counteract the loss in AP. If not, than you'll obviously suck against a Mage.
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07-20-2012   #5 (permalink)
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I pretty much agree with what you've said except this part.

Dukes have Sumo Suit for damage reduction against a group of people and Deadly Funky to AoE Skunk. I was able to mass chain Skunk a group of people if I was paying attention against all those skills flying around in the past. It's deadly if done right.

Siren Song may be one of the weaker AoE skills but if built right, it can do enough damage. When I use to play, I was able to hit 12k ~ 15k in PVP. I wasn't pure HP nor did I have like 100k HP. At best, I had around 85k HP with 9~10k Defense, which was enough to hit that kind of damage. Obviously with all these new MyShop/Content, you'll need higher stats compared to before but it's still plausible.

Just because a Duke has a 3124 build does not make them useless against a Mage. There's a reason why your gears are HP/HV comped and that's to counter Rust (plus other reasons). One Pair and Volley Kick can be just as strong if you have the HV to counteract the loss in AP. If not, than you'll obviously suck against a Mage.


Keep in mind that most mages nowadays have a 100k+ HP SoH and the ones with DB just gear up in HP against charm types. If you're fighting a mage with SoH (high MA) they're probably going to rust you, rendering OP and CS nearly useless, it's true that you probably still have a high HV to counter that but that way you're making your Siren Song less effective and since you're probably going to use high HP to counter that and to make your IR deal more damage you're going to lose some HV thus making you're card skills even weaker, unless you can pull out 1k HV with 80k+ HP and around 8~10k DP you're not going to do anything against a mage with high MA and a SoH.

Mages with DB. You're better off skunking it until DB dies and then you might have a chance (this if you don't miss, since when they go HP they also have a decent HV). Most dark mages can easily get 80k HP nowadays (the good ones at least) with ~1k MA and unless you go full HV with about 1.5k+ HV your MM isn't going make their DB not do any damage to you. You can always pot if you're that kind of fighter or aren't in a duel, I guess.

You do have a point with the Sumo Suit and Deadly Funk and by the way you were talking I guess you haven't played in a while?
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07-20-2012   #6 (permalink)
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Yes, I haven't played in about 3 years. However, I highly doubt those high stats can completely render out a Duke. Certain players have had those kind of stats way before all the better MyShop/Content was released and I still did find against them.

Just because someone has high stats doesn't mean they're good automatically. You have to know how a class works to make it effective and just having money means nothing. When I use to fight those kind of players, it would mostly end in a tie because 1-on-1/group matches just went on too long to bother.

The end result is it boils down on how you go about countering that kind of stuff. Doesn't matter if they have that kind of stats, it's still doable as long as it's done correctly.
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07-22-2012   #7 (permalink)
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If you want to go Gambler I suggest Pure HP because of the recoil but then you say you don't have a lot of funds.

That means you'll be weak since you can't fund to get HP equips.

Going Duke might be good for you. Since they have Sumo Suit. Just know that you'll need HP for both Gambler and Duke classes.
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07-22-2012   #8 (permalink)
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Going Duke will take more funds than going Gambler. Gamblers can stack only HP, but Dukes need more than just HP.

@Primal; There's really not that many Dark mages around with those kind of stats.. and the ones who do have it don't know how to play their character well. Most Darks also make the mistake of going 1441 Pure MA. |: Terrible build for a Dark.
 
07-23-2012   #9 (permalink)
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To be honest, I don't get it why you say that gambler needs tons of HP. Just go pure HV, with 1144 you won't need that much LK from equips to avoid recoil damage from FH, and it is a damn good AoE, + there's that new AoE coming for gamblers (the one with cards) which, with FH, allow you to cycle between them with no cooldown. Then there is card strike and one pair for 1v1, so I don't get the point why gambler should get IR/PC at all. Well the only advantage I see about pure HP is higher survivability, which in my opinion, is debatable anyway
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07-23-2012   #10 (permalink)
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so I don't get the point why gambler should get IR/PC at all.
They're the strongest AoE skills Gamblers have and won't get you killed.
 
07-23-2012   #11 (permalink)
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To be honest, I don't get it why you say that gambler needs tons of HP. Just go pure HV, with 1144 you won't need that much LK from equips to avoid recoil damage from FH, and it is a damn good AoE, + there's that new AoE coming for gamblers (the one with cards) which, with FH, allow you to cycle between them with no cooldown. Then there is card strike and one pair for 1v1, so I don't get the point why gambler should get IR/PC at all. Well the only advantage I see about pure HP is higher survivability, which in my opinion, is debatable anyway
Do you even know what a Gambler is?
Don't try to get the kid off track with something you know nothing about.
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07-23-2012   #12 (permalink)
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Yeah ok, w/e
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07-25-2012   #13 (permalink)
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I would just like to point out, that depending on the cooldown of Four-of-a-Kind and what it scales off of, getting IR/PC and going pure HP may be irrelevant. One bonus that IR/PC will have of FoaK would be the fact that it's self-centered and hit a couple more targets.

Just thought I'd throw in a couple cents.
 
07-25-2012   #14 (permalink)
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@infernal
Just throwing this out there, the new gambler aoe require 4 target in the circle or it will fail. If you're talking about the sucide skill that will get you kill at times and it weaken IR/PC because those push skill depend on your current hp.
 
07-26-2012   #15 (permalink)
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Then would you use PC if there's only 3 or 2 mobs around you? o.o
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07-26-2012   #16 (permalink)
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Then would you use PC if there's only 3 or 2 mobs around you? o.o
I'm actually confused by by this but here I go. To kill them. It's a nice AOE w/o recoil so yea PC/IR would do for more than 1 mob I guess.
 
07-26-2012   #17 (permalink)
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Well I would use card strike or OP for 1 mob and elemental melee for 2nd, for 3 mobs I would use full house, for 4 I would use four-of-a-kind and for 5 full house again.
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07-26-2012   #18 (permalink)
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Is four of a kind the new skill that will be coming out? If it is then that wouldn't be part of the cycle since it's not out yet. Also if it was PvM, I'd lean to more of either HP or a mix of HP and AP. I think you'll get enough HV to make monsters not sure hit you with your equips or maybe an alt/unique weapon. Racking more HV would sure increase the damage of OP,card strike and FH but AP has more impact on them. I'm not saying that going HV is wrong but this is just my opinion. Any build works for PvM imo.
 
07-26-2012   #19 (permalink)
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Well you do have a point, but don't forget about meta, it benefits from HV, like I got my coon to 3rd today and go meta. With mastered dodge master and lv 10 meta, my HV was nearly 500 with no MS and uncompounded equips and that's at lvl 130!
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07-26-2012   #20 (permalink)
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True but for PvM, they get a lot of attempts to hit you like say chaos tower with crazy dx monsters. There's always the 10% chance to hit so even if people get like 2k HV they wouldn't be immune to getting hit.
 

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