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10-12-2012   #29 (permalink)
Shadow5YA
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IGN: ColdShadow
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RoflKnife
There's no problem with doing crazy things with one button. You just seem to favour the games that make you do only one simple action with one press, or think they take more skill. Like I said, it's all in the spacing, timing, nuances, and such.

Dungeon Fighter Online is a great example. You have plenty of one button press skills that do amazing and flashy things! But the intermediate-advanced combos are very difficult. Why? Because of the things I mentioned.

Spacing is very, VERY important in DFO, you need to adjust your combo for pretty much every instance you get a hit.

Different classes fall faster or slower, so you you need to adjust your timing in air combos, or even do different combos.

Some classes have options to break out of being comboed or something, so you have to keep it in mind and predict when or where they'll use it.

Some classes can leave lingering projectiles and the like on the stage, so you need to adjust your combo yet again.

Just a few of the examples, but it's stuff like this that makes combos satisfying and difficult. The fact that you press buttons in order regardless of what they do to combo is irrelevant, that's not where the satisfaction or difficulty comes from. Every game will have you pressing buttons in order to combo!
I wouldn't DFO as an example of a good, satisfying PvP system considering many classes have skills with gigantic hitboxes, auto targeting, or summons that will zone for you with no effort. Even with Fair Arena scaling HP, gear, and damage more fairly, there are some classes that can approach, zone, and deal damage with little effort to where other classes have little to no answer.

I would consider Lunia in its early years to have more satisfying and execution heavy than DFO ever could. Sieg's Whirling Sword - Sidestep cancel and shifting along with Dainn's autostepping took quite a bit of execution.
However, the problem with current Lunia and DFO's combat systems is that both eventually became guilty of resets that bypass whatever anti-infinite system mechanic they used to have and therefore have classes become able to do combos that can kill from full or nearly full HP.
Touting the need to be conscious of the opponent's height and falling speed because of the game's increasing falling speed for longer combos becomes irrelevant when multiple classes can just reset with status effects like Stun or Freeze (with Fire damage or weapons to break the freeze).
With Lunia you have a similar problem. With the ability to skill cancel after a Space/Down Attack, every class short of Dacy and Lime can relaunch enemies ad infinitium and perform killing infinites.


Right now, considering this is from the makers of Lunia, I'm less worried about whether skills have reasonably sized hitboxes for a good spacing game and more about whether they have designed the appropriate game mechanics to prevent infinites from happening.